How do you feel about private forums?

[Clutch]

I have noticed on some sites, that they have "special" forums for only subscribers can view or post in. I was just wondering how you all felt about this type of deal.

For me it would be a bag of mixed feelings, I think it is good for the site to get money, so that newer, better things can come out of the site. But I feel it is unfair for those who can't afford a $30 a year subscription to a site also, just to post in a private forum. But it does show loyalty to a site, just like a site selling merchandise ( Clutch holds up his Icrontic.com shirt )

Just thought I'd get a feel of what you all think about this.

[Geeky1]

Difficult to say, because as much as I like this site, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't pay to have access to it. It's not that it's not good enough to justify it- it is- but there are too many other tech sites around that are free to justify spending money to subscribe to one...

[Rot Katze]

I agree

it's not that I wouldn't want to donate..it's juat that..I don't really think I need too

[Thrax]

If I ever had to pay to see one ounce of content here, my cheap ass would be leaving.

[mmonnin]

I'm a cheap ass as well. I wouldnt pay.

[Geeky1]

LOL. I was trying to be a bit more delicate than that, but I'm in the same boat- I'm a tightwad. I wouldn't pay either.

[RWB]

If I had the money, I would be proud to donate on a regular basis becuase this site is just great. But I am a college student trying to LIVE!

Anyways, what would you create that would be for subscribers only? Isn't the forum already open to just about everything?

[Red Dawn]

I wouldn't pay to read the forums, but if i had any spare cash i'd prob donate a bit to the folding team.

[Lincoln]

Luckily, three people do care enough to pay ;)

In any case, any such forum would probably go the way of DF unless it employed leading designers from AMD, ATI, Antec, and/or other such companies as forum leaders.

[WuGgaRoO]

i would pay for short media...if it was sumthing like...they needed the money due to bandwidth....i would indefinatly

[primesuspect]

I wouldn't pay a dime for this hunk of cr.... oh .. .never mind... ;)

[Geeky1]

Maybe I should rephrase what I said- I would most likely give money or whatever if the site needed it, but I'm not paying for a subscription to a website... at least not if it's the same price as a magazine subscription. If it were $5-10/year, I'd consider it... but it'd have to be a damn good site, and Short-Media is the only one I can think of that qualifies as "damn good" IMO, although Icrontic is very, very good as well, and I visit both regularly.

[a2jfreak]

I like Icrontic, but ever since it came back online it's felt like the life is gone. Perhaps that's because the enthusiastic people seem to be the ones who :fold: and those people came to S-M.

Only thing I can think of that S-M is truly lacking is some killer articles/reviews/how-to's. I'm as guilty as most, and more guilty than some, because the S-M staff has asked for people to do reviews/how-to's, etc. and I've not contributed.

I could write an article on how-to be a computer geek, but I doubt that's really needed or desired. :D

Geeky1 said
Short-Media is the only one I can think of that qualifies as "damn good" IMO, although Icrontic is very, very good as well, and I visit both regularly.

[Geeky1]

a2j, regarding the articles, I'm thinking I may do a review of the case I bought a week or so ago- a big AMS cube case that weighs 50lbs empty, has 10 5.25" bays and 5 hd bays- but I've been too busy to do it yet.

[a2jfreak]

If I had taken pictures of doing my case mod (which isn't anywhere near finished, hence the reason I've not updated my thread) then I might could have done a "how-to screw up a case mod" for S-M to post. ;D

Actually, the window cutout doesn't look that bad, and once I get it painted, put the window in there and possibly buy some lights I think it will look fine. I might need to paint the lock on the outside of the case panel, though, as my dremel got away from me and the sanding pad doesn't know the difference between metal and plastic, LOL.

[bothered]

I have mentioned this before but it got no response. I have seen on some sites a button on the front page where visitors could make a donation. S-M could use one of these, Then nobody has to pay but if you wanted to-Click here. I know three guys are out of pocket every month so they're not doing it for the money, There's no such thing as a free lunch, I'd help out.

bothered.

[Geeky1]

Not a bad idea

[a2jfreak]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought the site generated money through banner ads. I know I see images for genius IQ and Crucial from the main page. If S-M is hurting for cash I would imagine Shorty or MM or Prime or Keebs would let us know.

[Jimborae]

I already donate $5 a month to a site. It doesn't get me any privledges or private forums. Just satisfaction in the knowledge that I'm helping keep it alive.

It does have private forums but you only gain access after a certain number of post & by invitation only. Personally I'm not that fussed about private forums although it would be nice for somewhere to post material/topics of a more adult nature. On the flipside however private forums can be seen as devisive & exclusive which can lead to more problems.

Regards

Jim

[Shorty]

a2jfreak said
Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought the site generated money through banner ads. I know I see images for genius IQ and Crucial from the main page. If S-M is hurting for cash I would imagine Shorty or MM or Prime or Keebs would let us know.

The banner ads do generate a small amount of money for the site but nowhere near enough to pay for itself. Short-Media has been live for several months but the three owners are funding it to stay here :) (we have never pretended any less). It's not a pity plea though, we do it because we love it or it would be pointless us bothering ;) We don't hurt for cash. We all have full-time jobs and this is a hobby (a hell of a time consuming one!).

Im not really a big fan of private, paid subscription forums. Having private forums for "elite" members only brings upset and resentment from what I've seen. Nice idea but riddled with potential for upset.

So...

Articles/Reviews, well we have a few contacts and we are starting to get some nice things to write about. Starting to get communications going but it's a process of convincing. We have to convince people to lend (not send) things for us to write about. They are slowly getting convinced we are for real and not in it for the "free" stuff (which we've yet to see ;D).

The members contributions have been awesome so far. Thrax's quality articles have generated good traffic and Nixxer's case article went down a storm. It's all good from where Im sitting :) We want more! Want you to do our work for us? Not really, rather than the three owners getting all the publishing space.. why not give some to the members who support us? Get ya name known, might even make ya famous :thumbsup:

We are hoping to step up a gear in the future with content and presentation. Short-Media was setup in record time and there have been some annoying bugs to sort out (site slowdowns & dropouts) but alot of work has gone into a much improved SM ;)

Wanna know something, just ask :)

[primesuspect]

The ads generate a negligible amount of revenue, but there is still a significant output of cash each month from the three of us.

No worries guys, we have no intention of ever asked for subscription fees. If there ever comes a time when we need money for something, we'll ask, exactly as we did with the DVD burner, and you guys came through in a flash. I'd much rather have a site where money is donated on an as-needed basis. Private forums are exactly as shorty said: alienating.

This is a hobby for us, and we love it.

[Templar]

Bring on the ads. I'm immune to popups :)

[Leonardo]

Put up a little donation 'button' on the opening forums page. I'd be happy to contribute. MANY of us would. Just look at how fast the membership bought the DVD burner for the site! This is a generous group here, knowing the value of the site.

[Clutch]

I agree with all of you, I am against private forums of any sort. It does make the members that aren't subscribers feel left out and that will cause a site to loose many members. We have a very good site here, and as soon as some more articles get up, and everything gets set in stone then we will have one of the best tech sites out there. And with an awesome crew leading us and all the great members, we want need anyone to pay to view the site.

[Leonardo]

About a year and a half ago, Anandtech tried a limited subscription service at their forums. You could subscribe and have fast access via a robust service; or you could be an ordinary member, using a slow server. I did not subscribe, but did curtail my visits when browsing became painfully slow. The subscription scheme didn't last long. Perhaps they lost members, perhaps traffic was significantly down, I don't know. Access is free to all there now and service is good. Their site continues to grow.

[Templar]

It might be a good idea to setup an email server for subscribers. No private forums, just an email address and some other stuff.

[primesuspect]

Now that's something that we could do - offer an @short-media.com email address for a donation. We've got PLENTY of capacity. I was also thinking of short-media t-shirts/hats or something like that. But email addresses are just...... cool.

[Leonardo]

Maybe I'm just not creative enough - buy why would someone want another email addy when there are plenty of webmail services for free? Not saying it's a mediocre idea; just that I don't understand.

[primesuspect]

Cool factor.

[Thrax]

I'd take an @short-media.com for donation! That'd be great.

<font color=green>*Thrax grins</font>

I'd definitely buy a short media t-shirt:

Black with the logo on the left breast.


And a short media polo:

White with embroidered logo on the left breast.



Or something. heh.

[Geeky1]

I'd buy Short-Media shirts.
I'd also consider the e-mail if it supported outlook (pop + smtp) and was reasonable...

[Templar]

Leonardo said
Maybe I'm just not creative enough - buy why would someone want another email addy when there are plenty of webmail services for free? Not saying it's a mediocre idea; just that I don't understand.

Alotta those are web-based only unless you pay for Pop3 access AFAIK. Personally, I like my Pop3 access :D

I need a new email account. Fileshack is good for zipping through lines, but the email sucks :(

[Clutch]

Oh yea I'm all over the polo shirt idea, I mean that is all I wear, just Nautica polo knit shirts, call me a prep, but I dress in style baby :)

I also like the sm e-mail address. And why have one? Because most of the e-mail services out there are filled with ads and crap, I'm with mail.com now and it sucks ass, everytime you send a e-mail out you get hit with a full page ad about subscribing for ad free e-mail. I used to love having a e-mail address for my business, no ads to deal with.


I would wear a sm polo shirt though, and love the e-mail address idea.

[SimGuy]

A few SM mouse-pads would find homes with my systems here. I'm also up for the e-mail addy idea. I'd love to have a SM e-mail, if not just for the coolness factor :D

I would be willing to donate money on an as needed basis for items the site requires (such as the aforementioned DVD burner), but I don't think there are any websites on the intarweb that I would pay to have access to.

[Geeky1]

No mouse pads for me. At least not unless you guys have acrylic/abs pads done (like the ratpadz/func/everglide etc.)

[FAH_WW]

As someone having to pay for 3 servers at the moment to host some stuff that takes up bandwidth, the folding community, and my own forums, I know all too well how much it all costs.

In my case, all is paid for just by me:scratch: :scratch:

Advertising is a tricky one. For me, the ONLY advertising that helps LOADS is broadband buyer. I get 5 pence per click through there. This is the only income I've got. All the other ones quite frankly are hardly worth it for the amount of traffic I get.

I said I wouldnt put adverts on the folding site, and I'll stick to that. I don't like to polute the main site with it. I could slap some adverts on stats pages (if I had them) and on the home page, but no-one hits that pretty much...

I reckon running the sites has so far cost me about 1000 GBP a year, averaged. I do it because I want to provide the service. I'm sure the same goes for da 3 amigos here :thumbsup:

As for private forums - I've got them on both main forums I run, but it's for admin only/mods only/team private (as you wouldnt want all those private forums shown).

This is different from the subscription-only private forum. I am in that sense a cheapskate as well ;D

Donations help, but I believe over this year it's been less than 1% of my income. Still, I don't think I should personally beg for money all the time. If someone feels they want to donate I provide the facility & am darn greatful for the generousity shown. If they dont want to donate, so be it.

At the end of the day - if I run out of dosh the site will disappear. Simple as that :vimp: :vimp: - I'm hopeful it won't happen for some time to come :D

[a2jfreak]

This is off topic, but FAH_WW, you said you get 5 pence per click. Is a pence 1/100th of a pound? The cent or penny is 1/100th of a dollar. The nickle is 1/20th of a dollar. The dime is 1/10th of a dollar. The quarter is 1/4th of a dollar.

[Jimborae]

I'd be up for an email address, mouse mats clothing, case badges etc. I'm a real sucker for that type of thing. :)

P.S. 5 pence is the UK equivalent of a nickle


Jim

[FAH_WW]

Yep pence = 1/100th of a pound, it's not a lot but it all helps :D

[Creep]

Thrax said
I'd take an @short-media.com for donation! That'd be great.

&lt;font color=green&gt;*Thrax grins&lt;/font&gt;

I'd definitely buy a short media t-shirt:

Black with the logo on the left breast.


And a short media polo:

White with embroidered logo on the left breast.



Or something. heh.


That's all the stuff I want!

[Omega65]

Thrax said
I'd take an @short-media.com for donation! That'd be great.

&lt;font color=green&gt;*Thrax grins&lt;/font&gt;

I'd definitely buy a short media t-shirt:


DITTO!

[CyrixInstead]

Yeah! I'd take an S-M email address. Also, I'd be quite proud to wear an S-M T-shirt.

Get on the case boys, and watch the dough come rolling in!!!

~Cyrix

[MediaMan]

When I first started visiting tech sites I was astounded that there was so much information ....for free. I always found the idea of "private" forums a joke. Especially charging for them.

Caps, t-shirts, coffee cups and mousepads are for promotional use. If they become so popular then I could see making the item for sale.

I never did like the paypal donation buttons. To me...they always say "I'm not doing well". I really appreciate you guys wanting to donate but there's some weird gene inside of me that says to keep this place free for you guys. Even if it costs me money.

Look at it this way...if I weren't here doing what I do..I'd be out at the bar with a friend. 2-3 nights of that and I'd have spent 3 times what it takes to pay for my share of the bandwidth...plus I'd have a nasty hangover.

My strong belief is to keep this place free. With a bit of hard work from me it the ads will begin to pay for the bandwidth. Want to thank us? Hop on by the front page once in a while and click an ad or two. Just when you remember as you are making your way into the forums.

[Templar]

These ads wouldn't ignore clicks from an IP after two or three clicks, would they? :)

[FAH_WW]

I'd agree having a PayPal button may say that income isnt coming in ;) - but then what else can you do. For example on the folding site I cant run adverts on the forum as I said I wouldnt. I can put some on the home page possibly, but I will never get the cost back out. By providing the PayPal facility you at least offer a choice to those who feel generous :D

I don't think I'll get rich from the site soon, and no doubt the same goes for SM as well, but it would be good to see break-even or nearer to it ;)

Fully agree with the personal investment point of view though, it's the only way to get going and sometimes to keep it going.

I wish I'd have enough time to get advertising sorted for my own site, but a year later, still not had enough time LOL ;)

[BDR]

I'd gladly donate $5 a month to help keep this place online.
I do for other forums I think are worthwhile.
Bandwith isn't free.

[MediaMan]

When I made the transition from IC to SM with Shorty and Prime we had grand thoughts of making enough to actually pay for a board meeting in Mexico.

HA!

Our goals have been somewhat made more realisitic. Right now we are just hoping to earn a couple hundred a month to pay for bandwidth. If it does that...I'll be happy. It's nice to have an obsession that doesn't cost anything...well besides the extra hardware I have to buy in order to support the reviews.

The three of us did this knowing full well that the first year would be in the red. We did not come into this thinking that we'd make millions. Sure we had grand talks but we were also realistic.

Part of the charm for you guys is having a free site. I want to keep working that way. The fact that you guys keep coming back day after day and enjoy helping, yakking and tweaking is what we want.

As far as the front page. Read the articles. Learn. Just the fact that the page loads is good. Click on an ad every so often. You don't need to hammer on them. A click a day is great but you don't have to.

Just keep being part of the SM family and I'll be very happy with that. :)

[Clutch]

We will all continue to stay in the family, and as one of the best online community's on the web. I woud also be proud to wear a s-m shirt, heck just like I do when I wear my Icrontic shirt when I go out, or to school, got to represent baby :) It isn't very often that you find sites like short-media where there is a great team leading the site, and a very giving user base, I mean look at all the dedicated folding rigs we have up and running.

So about those s-m shirts, hehe

[fuxor]

I would gladly wear a s-m shirt as well :)

the only other forum I post in only allows members in, and certain sections require a degree of participation. It's a free community, but to some degree it is still private. Sorry I haven't been very active here, real life and school is stretching me pretty thin... but i'm lurking about ;)

[Leonardo]

My strong belief is to keep this place free. With a bit of hard work from me it the ads will begin to pay for the bandwidth. Want to thank us?

So be it; I see your point.

What I can and will do, if the admin dudes let me know, is to do another fundraiser should Short-Media require more hardware to enhance the site. The members' puchase of the DVD burner was fun and successful. I have no doubts the membership would rise to the occasion should the need present itself.

Leo

:cool:

[CyrixInstead]

What about the @short-media.com email idea though??

I think it's a cracking idea, and if it weren't too much trouble I reckon many of the S-M would pay for it.

CyrixInstead@short-media.com - that would be cool, especially when I post on other forums - might lead to some new members!!

And it would certainly make us original - and that's what we have been priding ourselves in here is it not? (amongst quality etc of course!)

~Cyrix

[mmonnin]

I would pay for my own email even when I am staff already. I know Icrontic has/did have their own email addies.