tactom is gone, and now so is . . .

[a2jfreak]

BDR???? Say it isn't so!!! (http://folding.extremeoverclocking.com/member_overview.php?UserID=52217)

Check her stats, it shows absolutely nothing for 10/9, not even 0! Today there is a 0!

BDR, we need you! Don't make us cry again to get you back!

BTW, tactom, if you happen to read this. We love you too (in a strictly folding way! :D) and we'll welcome you back if you ever decide you want to fold for #93 again!

C'mon, guys! W/ tactom gone (hopefully not forever) and BDR turning into Mrs. MIA (hopefully due to a net-outage) we need to re-double our efforts! I know some (like myself) don't physically have any more machines to add at the moment, but we can try to recruit some more people! Let's all :fold::fold::fold:!!!!!

[TheBaron]

well on the bright side, tactom doesn't appear to be folding for anyone ELSE either (at least under the same user name)

[Mt_Goat]

Fear not! In This thread (http://www.short-media.com/forum/newreply.php?s=&action=newreply&postid=48222) she said she will be folding for Angel_Heather for a while.
BDR said
I'll be folding under Angel_Heather for awhile.

[TBonZ]

BDR stated she was going to fold under Angel_Heather and it looked that way yesterday with the points spiking, however, today looks like Heather's production is getting back to normal levels.

I guess she was really angry with people mocking Dell machines enough to stop folding with us, that will be true of course if we don't see that spike in Heather's stats again. :(

[GnomeWizardd]

Not back to norrmal lvls! i got 2 pcs on Angel_Heather now!

[a2jfreak]

If BDR is folding for Angel Heather (will all her power) and mtgoat and gnome, I just might have a fight on my hands I can't hold back! I can't even catch BDR, I definitely can't hold off BDR + mtgoat + gnome!

/me is gonna have his butt kicked.

[mmonnin]

tatcom is folding for another team and under another name. He is gone and dearly missed. Always welcome but we did farewell.

Same goes for you BDR.

Fear not, my lab will be coming aboard in about 2 weeks. 2 more weeks then I get a week off and I will hopefully set it up then.

[Mt_Goat]

a2jfreak said
If BDR is folding for Angel Heather (will all her power) and mtgoat and gnome, I just might have a fight on my hands I can't hold back! I can't even catch BDR, I definitely can't hold off BDR + mtgoat + gnome!

* a2jfreak is gonna have his butt kicked.

I don't know now as I haven't seen any new points for a while.

[csimon]

TBonZ said
I guess she was really angry with people mocking Dell machines enough to stop folding with us, that will be true of course if we don't see that spike in Heather's stats again. :(

Mocking Dell machines? Oh the nerve!!! I can attribute at least 350k of my points to dell machines alone!!! ;D

[TheLostSwede]

To be honest, im quite sick of this running around thing to different teams. It REALLY doesnt natter for which team you fold, but it destroys the community feeling over it. Pissed cause of a little Dell bashing? You´re kidding right?

[shwaip]

meh....meh I say!

[Geeky1]

Mackanz... dunno for sure. I made a comment agreeing with Leonardo... specifically, I said that the Dell machines my school has (P4-1.6, 512MB PC133, ATi Rage 128 32MB) run slow as hell, which BDR didn't seem to appreciate... :rolleyes:

[a2jfreak]

Well, I just hope she isn't gone, but just had a net outage, or went out of town and didn't tell us or something. Maybe her old team had a passing and she's folding under someone's username for a little while in honor.

If she did leave, I wish her the best and she knows both she and her points are welcome to come back. She's even welcome to come back w/out her points, but those points are nice! :)

[muddocktor]

BDR, I really hope you didn't leave us, gal.:confused: It was really nice to have a lady that knows computers and the project here on the team. You are a shining example of why we need more women involved with our team and the project.:)

Even if you do decided to fold for someone else, be sure to fold. And please stop by to visit, whatever you decide.:)

[Leonardo]

I made a comment agreeing with either MTGoat or Leonardo

Yes, I made a comment about my office Dell Octiplex computers being horribly slow, but also being completely reliable folders! Reliability is certainly as important as speed.

[Mt_Goat]

No matter what she was runninig she was an outstanding contributor. She was making good headway under her own name and added greatly to the efforts of Angel_Heather.

[BDR]

Come on guys.. I told ya up front that I also fold for another team and I will continue to switch over and give them a boost sometimes because I owe them, and I can't just walk away.
(They are a smaller team that is not in competition with S-M)

Yep Mack, I got irritated. I'm entitled to my thoughts and feelings.
I won't apologise for that now or in the future.

But, if I dissapear for a day or 2, don't assume I've run off.
I will be back.

If this really messes with your "team spirit" let me know, because this isn't free for me and I want to be where I know my efforts are doing some good. I need to make it worth my while too, you know.

Right now I have 7 rigs running as Angel_Heather.
I am also running some big 2500 step WU's again, so they will take time to finish. :(

This post is not intended to cause a division here.

No fuss, no muss.
Everything back to normal... please.

[primesuspect]

A gentle reminder that we would do well to remember that it's not WHO one folds for that's important.

Thanks for the explanation, BDR. Mostly, we were worried that something was wrong with your connection/rigs/self.... As always, you can choose to fold for whomever you want. :)

[a2jfreak]

Yay! :) She hasn't left! WooHoo!

Good to see you again, BDR!

// Edit: I hate those 2500 frame WUs too! They take FfFoOoRrReEeVvVeEeRrR to fold!

[Straight_Man]

Um, thou shalt NOT mock Dell-- one guess what this SITE runs on?? Though NOT the STOCK O\S!

Actually, I have a lot of customers VERY happy with their Dells, and the local library has gone to Dell systems. Basscily, they offer vlaue for money and sell ENOUGH that they can buy at very good prices and in bulk. People want AMD machines, Dell is responding, and soem servers are coming available with Opteron CPUs.

I like Dell better than Compaq and\or HP.

Others, ALL majors make top end and lower end, and Optiplex is a Business line-- BDR, your boxes are neat and very welcome to fold with us.(Don't get me wrong, it is the heart that counts and you prove you have a good one by running that many boxes for Folding@Home AT ALL and any help you give you are hereby thanked for with a LOAD of thanks. :) )

John-- who can only afford to run TWO boxes right now.

[Geeky1]

Ageek... both you and BDR are entitled to your opinions, just as she said. Personally, I despise most off-the-shelf systems & MFRs, because I've worked on enough of them to discover that they seem to do a lot of stuff bass-ackwards, and sacrifice quality for cost savings (although, given that they have to make money, that's not all that surprising). Dell and Compaq are at the top of my list of most-hated MFRs, quickly followed by Apple, HP, Gateway, etc.

I realize the site runs on a Dell/Dells. I gave Prime & Shorty a hard time about that the day I signed up, which was like the day after the site went live...

However, if you like them, you know... suit yourself. I won't try to talk you out of it. However, if someone asks for my opinion on them, I will give them my honest answer, which is that I think they're a ripoff, because you can generally buy/build something better for less by going to a local company.

[Mt_Goat]

I'm sorry I forgot you were going to go back to help on occassion, which is even more honorable in my book! As i said before, you are an oustanding contributor. A class flolder is a class folder, period! Glad you're here! :D :thumbsup: :wave:

[muddocktor]

Glad to see that you are still around, BDR.:) As far as the Dell bashing goes, it sounds more like jealousy that you have so many rigs than anything else to me.;) And csimon laughed all the way to his #1 position on the team with his Dell rigs he has charge of.;D

I don't care what you fold with, as long as you fold. I personally fold with my Dell laptop along with all the other rigs in my farm and it will produce between 200-250 points/week, depending on the WU's it draws.

Fold on and be sure to come and shoot the breeze a bit.:fold:

[a2jfreak]

Ageek: Where did you hear that Dell will start using Opteron? Everything I've seen lately indicated that Dell will not go down the AMD-route anytime in the near future.

[primesuspect]

John, that's a great point: This site runs on a dell! ;D

However, a2jfreak is right - at this time, Dell has roundly rejected (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=12030) any AMD offerings in their servers, workstations, or desktops.

But still, every machine and manufacturer has its place. Dell makes great cookie-cutter boxes for a good price. I recommend them all the time. I own three, myself.

[TBonZ]

Thanks for the head's up BDR and like primes said, we really didn't know for sure what could of happened. Sometimes the speculation can seem pretty bad but we are a very tight community and can get attached very quick to people who come around here often and we notice when people like yourself leave\take a break\fold for another Team.

Next time, I will know that everything is alright and I'll assume first that you're giving your other team a quick boost. :)

[BDR]

Thanks guys, and Geeky1, love your disclaimer. ;D

[mmonnin]

WHAT!! This site is on a DELL!! omgwtf

hehe. I dont care for some of the things they do and the way they cut corners on cooling. Propriatary is the most hated part of Boxed machines. Cant stand it. Had a Packard Bell that was that way and guess where they are now?

[TheLostSwede]

BDR said
Thanks guys, and Geeky1, love your disclaimer. ;D

I wonder if that disclaimer is a work of Shortster?

[Templar]

Most of us around 16 to 21 probably started on a Dell, HP, or Packard Bell way back in the day. I personally started on a Dell myself, and my second PC was an Alienware (Alienware > Dell :D )

My next one will be bought from parts. I had no idea how to build a PC when the Alienware was bought :)

[Geeky1]

Mackanz...

No, I put that in myself. :D

[BDR]

I started on a HP that was a special deal of sorts back about 6 years ago. I gave the tower to my son, along with a 15" monitor that I had bought separately. I kept the original monitor (an S70) and I still use today. At the time it was pretty top of the line.
500 mhz Celi, 10 gig hd, 128 sdram.

I got another deal, about 5 years ago, on a bigger HP tower and used it, still do sometimes, although it's really sub par now.
533 Celeron, 20 gig hd, 256 maxxed out sdram. I put XP Home on it and it still runs fine, albeit slow.

Then about 3 years ago I got the Dell. Just the tower, kb, mouse and speakers. Now I know I could have built a tower cheaper, but back then I was a little afraid that I didn't have the skills, and I would end up with a bunch of components and no pc that worked.
I did get a better graphics card for the time, and added ram to max it out at 512. I also added a Philips Acoustic Edge 5.1 sound card and some halfway decent speakers.
One thing I will say about the Dell. It's very stable.

In January I got brave and decided to give building my own a try.
With some help from some good people I was able to build a decent tower without too many problems, just noob builder stuff.

Then I saw that "hey this isn't hard at all", and I've built 7 towers altogether now.

Some have decent specs and some are a conglomeration of used and older hardware. They make up my Folding Farm.

I sold one rig (my Rainbow Pimp Rig) to my sis, but I still have all the others besides the one I gave my son.

Although I am seriously considering taking the HP out of commission and using it's spot on the desk for a new tower.

I like my Dell, and use it every day as my main rig, while the rest are purely Folders.
Would I buy another Dell? No, because I know I can build my own now.


My employer bought new case rack type Dell servers, so they must be reliable. ??


edited for typo

[primesuspect]

Their servers are very very good. We own both Sun and Dell servers and I love them both.

[Shorty]

DELL PowerEdge @ work here. Very good kit.

[profdlp]

One thing to keep in mind when knocking pre-fab computers (as opposed to the home-built custom machines most of us prefer) is that your expertise is quite valuable.

Yeah, you can build a better computer for less by doing it yourself - if you know how. The only fair comparison would be how much would you charge for your custom-made rigs if you had to live on the money you made selling them? Not to mention providing 24/7/365 tech support, honoring warranty issues, marketing, shipping, taxes, etc.

Bottom-line is that your know-how is worth quite a bit of money. Unless you factor that into the equation you are not making a fair comparison.

No, I would not buy a Dell. Neither would I pay a plumber, painter, drywall installer, electrician (in most cases!), carpenter, locksmith, or any of the other jobs I know how to do thanks to my jack-of-all-trades work experience. That doesn't mean that their services aren't valuable, merely that I won't pay extra for someone else to do something I can do myself.
:wave:

[Leonardo]

Well said!

[Geeky1]

Prof, the main reason I don't like Dell in particular is the proprietary stuff they use. The only other time I've run into that is in a Compaq P4 machine that came with one of the Zeiss precision measuring devices that my grandparent's business bought a while back, which had a proprietary PS as well. None of the other pre-fab system builders use proprietary stuff, afaik. They may use hard-to-find stuff, such as those sff PSes, but nothing proprietary, AFAIK.

[profdlp]

Geeky1 said
Prof, the main reason I don't like Dell in particular is the proprietary stuff they use...
That's a fair point. I always thought companies did that as a sly way of making you "married" to their product. Until recently, I think most of the big name companies did it that way. It's only been in the past few years that companies have begun to move away from this practice. My crystal ball (it needs windex sometimes...) says that Dell will eventually have to go along with this trend. My first computer was an Acer (wince - this was before their "purple swiss-cheese" fiasco, though), and the best thing i can say for it now is that I was able to upgrade it with off-the-shelf components.

While I do loathe proprietary parts, you can't single out Dell. Packard-Bell, Compaq (before the merger), Gateway, H-P, and IBM (when they still bothered to make them) ALL did the same thing (though not necessarily for every model they produced). Not to mention the famous emachine power supplys...:vimp:

[mmonnin]

PB was back in '92 when we got it.

[BDR]

Proprietary, yes. You have to keep in mind these pc's are made for those that probably aren't going to be building their own towers, and do very little upgrading. Mrs and Mrs. J.Q. Public, average pc owners.
Remember how many people don't even know they are supposed to update their Anti virus .dat files? or take the Windows Updates? They probably aren't going to upgrade at all, but rather buy a new one in X amount of years.

Keeping the unlearned masses buying new instead of upgrading is a good business move for Dell, HP, Gateway, etc.

Maybe not the most respectable thing in our P.O.V., but good for their sales rates.
It's business.

[Geeky1]

Keeping the unlearned masses buying new instead of upgrading is a good business move for Dell, HP, Gateway, etc.

Maybe not the most respectable thing in our P.O.V., but good for their sales rates.
It's business.

Understood. However, it's that last point that bothers me- it's not exactly a real honest thing to do. Admittedly, their first priority is to make money, but it still bugs me.

[Leonardo]

BDR, as long as the beige box makers are honest with their customers - for the most part, they are, I don't see a problem with encouraging complete system replacements. Yes, most people don't upgrade parts.

But let's talk trends. As a percentage of computer owners, more and more people have learned that a RAM upgrade is often adequate for a speed boost. More people now are upgrading hard drives rather than drooling for the latest factory box at Best-Buy. Certainly, the view of the PC by most is as a communications appliance. It is indeed so. Just another machine, albeit a very important machine. (We are a rather skewed bunch here at S-M! With us, it's personal!)

One trend that is telling is the proliferation of custom shops. Five years ago few would consider buying a "no-name" computer. Today, almost everyone knows someone who owns a computer without a big name on the case. Perhaps this is why proprietary monsters so common in the 90's aren't as common now.

I'm a case in point. I might not have stumbled onto DIY computer building had it not been for my first PC - Packard Bell proprietary junk. In only a year, I learned the hard way how difficult and expensive it was to squeeze more performance out a system not meant for upgrading.

[BDR]

True Leo, but I live in small town America. The custom shops haven't hit here yet. (Maybe I should open one.. lol)
We have one pc shop and I don't particularly trust the people that work there. I wouldn't send anyone to them.

You have to drive at least 40 miles to a bigger city to find even Best Buy, Circuit City, or a real computer shop.

Most people around here buy an HP from WalMart or order a Dell or Gateway online. One of my co-workers even bought her pc from QVC.. lol.

[profdlp]

Geeky1 said
Understood. However, it's that last point that bothers me- it's not exactly a real honest thing to do. Admittedly, their first priority is to make money, but it still bugs me.
It bugs me, too. It's not limited to the computer world, though. A few years back I paid $75 for a headlight for the car I had at the time. There was nothing special about it. The guy at the auto parts store said that GM was allowed to hold an exclusive patent on it for three years. When it burned out I was able to replace it for $8.50.


BDR said
True Leo, but I live in small town America. The custom shops haven't hit here yet. (Maybe I should open one.. lol)
We have one pc shop and I don't particularly trust the people that work there. I wouldn't send anyone to them.

You have to drive at least 40 miles to a bigger city to find even Best Buy, Circuit City, or a real computer shop.

Most people around here buy an HP from WalMart or order a Dell or Gateway online. One of my co-workers even bought her pc from QVC.. lol.
Thank goodness for newegg, etc. At my first tech job we built custom rigs. It was fun to compare our WinTune scores with the big name brands - it was a drubbing. Most of our customers were corporate types who knew exactly what they wanted in a computer. The rest were usually gamers who wanted to get the latest and greatest.

I bet you could do just fine with your own shop. Let me know if you do it - maybe I'll apply for a job!
:wave:

[Leonardo]

Wow, must be really small town.

Your points are not lost one me. I was simply trying to state that the custom shops, IMO, are forcing changes with the big manufacturers. Data show that while the major manufacturers remain stagnant in sales, the local builders are growing.

I'll echo what you said about Dells - they are stable. If I had to recommend an affordable out-of-the-retail box computer to a friend, it would probably be Dell.

[Geeky1]

Prof, don't even get me started on cars. I drive a 1986 Mercedes 560SEL... the spark plug wires are $180/set. :eek:


//Edit

Leo, you're right. I know a lot of people (myself and my dad included) who have been put off of Dell, Compaq, HP, etc. by the company's own doing (e.g. proprietary parts, etc.). Consequently, my dad, who does system administration for my grandfather's business, buys all of our computers from a local company. We've done EASILY $30-40k of business with them, and since we're one of their biggest (if not THE biggest) customers, they are willing to basically bend over backwards to help us out if we need it, which is something that can't be said of a lot of these larger companies.

[a2jfreak]

I got Mercedes engineering for much less than buying an actual "Mercedes." I guess that's one good thing for the Diamler/Chrysler deal w/ Mercedes. I have a Mercedes truck, hahahahahaha.

[LagPacket]

profdlp said
While I do loathe proprietary parts, you can't single out Dell. Packard-Bell, Compaq (before the merger), Gateway, H-P, and IBM (when they still bothered to make them) ALL did the same thing (though not necessarily for every model they produced). Not to mention the famous emachine power supplys...:vimp:

I work for IBM and we still have a personal PC division, in fact they assemble them in the U.S. to my knowledge. The HDDs are made in Arizona/Texas, but that's about all that IBM makes that goes into them- most of IBM's HDD business is laptop and microdrive devices.

The only proprietary pieces I've ever found inside IBM's were the cases. Everything else is pretty standard stuff... I've been in and out of IBMs in particular since I was about 12 or so and I don't ever remember finding proprietary crap in them... just very strange case layouts, with very sharp edges!

While you mention it though I do think that it is a very sneaky and underhanded way of doing business. There is no need to force your customers into your product line unless your products are sub-standard in my opinion. Schwinn is the first company I know of that started doing that on purpose with their bicycles, although to my knowledge they stopped after some years when they lost their bear's share of that market. Microsoft consistently does this with their altered "global" standard interpretations, although it wouldn't surprise me if they stop trying to do that once they have some decent competition as a simple GUI desktop O/S. The only time I've ever had to delve into a Dell I was very displeased at finding the IDE cable was some propietary cable with slightly fanned out pins on the sides and angled sides. It made it just far enough off so you couldn't just buy a brand X drive and plug it in... I was not impressed since I could have used that rig if it weren't for that fact.

As far as Dell's today I actually recommend them to people when they ask me my opinion. In general I despise pre-built systems, but I also know not every wants to become intrinsically familiar with their computers innards. My first computer was a custom built by me, and I will never use a pre-built as my primary desktop, but if you were to ask me my opinion about pre-builts though I would only suggest Dell, Sony VIAO, or IBM (IBM only if you weren't going to use it for gaming or intense purposes). I generally try to dissuade people from choosing IBM, but considering the product is slow-but-still-steady then it's at least better off then any HP/Compaq/Gateway/eMachines!

[QCH2002]

The way I look at Dell and the "Build it Yourself" PC is simple. Total cost to build and operate. I have 4 custom systems in my house. One is running Linux Firewall, One W2K3 Server (Beta Tester), One running XP Pro, and the Other W2K. I am lucky that I have the W2K3 Server Beta Testing version or I couldn’t afford it. The Microsoft XP Pro… Gift from a customer that bought an extra. The Linux firewall… free. The W2K I bought. If I had to buy a new system, I would love to build it but I can't afford the software and overall support for the system. You would be hard pressed to beat Dell's prices because of the volume discount they have with hardware vendors and Microsoft and not to mention the warranty and support.

There is no way someone could build a new P4 system with Windows XP & Microsoft Works for less than Dell. A new Dell P4 with monitor, keyboard, mouse and speakers for under $500??? Yeah, right. Can you have it ready to go in less than a week? Might but tough. Plan and simple... You want a hot rod of a system that can bust out over any other... build it. You want a home PC with some good power and some upgradeability... Dell.