What hardware do I need to install OS/X?

[Byron172]

I have recently been given a copy of Apple Panther OS and need to know what makes a computer Apple/Mac compatible. Do I need a specific mobo or specific processor and if so where is a good place to look. Or can I maybe install on one of my older towers that were running Windows, if I wipe the hard drive clean and format to Mac's filing system? Excuse my ignorance it's my first real look into Mac software and the like.....Cheers.

[Snarkasm]

www.apple.com/store

Everything else is just an illegal hack. If you're determined to do it, you can (I have), but your old spare hardware won't do it.

[Sonorous]

http://wiki.osx86project.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page. nuff said ;D

[airbornflght]

Well it depends. You need a build that was compiled for the x86 architecture. Second you need hardware that closely mirrors apple's hardware. After that it's holding your tongue in the right place and getting lucky. But yeh, check out the OSx86 project. They have a wealth of information as well as a flash drive that is supposed to simplify the process a lot by automatically handling drivers.

And even then, once you get it installed, you can usually not update without botching the install. Right now it is truly something for enthusiast or to just mess around with. It definitely won't cut it for a 'daily driver'

And while it may be against the EULA to my knowledge apple hasn't launched suits against anyone who has done so.

[Sonorous]

They have a wealth of information as well as a flash drive that is supposed to simplify the process a lot by automatically handling drivers.

From what I understand that flash drive is only going to be available in certain countries.

[Byron172]

So what is it that differentiates a Mac from a PC?

Can I build a Mac (without hacking a PC) or do I have to buy one?

Thanks for all the advice......:)

[Thrax]

The primary difference is that Macs use a technology called EFI in place of a PC's BIOS chip. EFI is what allows sounds, full-color graphics and useful interactive menus before the OS has even loaded. Most copies of Windows and Linux are designed for the BIOS in mind (Though there are a few exceptions), and as a result the PC industry continues to use the BIOS.

Because Mac OS has no idea how to talk to anything but EFI without significant alterations to the disc's contents (And illegal ones at that), Mac OS doesn't work terribly well on a PC.

If you want a Mac, you must buy a Mac.

[Byron172]

So I need to buy a Mac - anyone know where I should look for a decent second hand one (I'm in South Australia). Thanks for clearing it up for me Thrax, I had no idea about EFI opposed to BIOS etc.
Thinks I might go with Ubuntu for the time being as an alternative to Windows and look into OS/X down the track......Cheers.

[airbornflght]

ebay? I'm not really sure. I never understood why apple kept their software exclusive to their hardware. Arguably they wouldn't be making as much money on hardware, but they would be selling so many copies of OSX it would be unreal. And the os is 98 percent x86/bios compatible.

[Thrax]

Because the software is what makes a Mac a Mac.

[Byron172]

I suppose this is one way they remain more exclusive - they can separate the wheat from the chaff because only a real enthusiast will shell out the dosh for the whole kit.......ah well, on to Linux I suppose.

It'd be nice to be able to have a Windows, an OS/X and a Linux OS all on the same PC so that you could boot into whichever took your fancy at the time but it seems like too much trouble. Thank the computer gods for KVM switches.......:D

[Byron172]

Because the software is what makes a Mac a Mac.

Yeah, some would say it's also the same software that makes Vista a copy of a Mac ;D

[airbornflght]

IF that's what MS was going for they failed miserably. I'm hoping for better days with Win. 7. Hopefully it's not a resource hog. I think the UI needs to be rethought, but then again a portion of their customer base is unwilling to learn anything new. Which is the reason most of them use xp/vista when there may be better alternatives.

[Byron172]

I've only just heard about Windows 7 in the last few days and need to do some research. Is this going to be a new O/S to follow Vista or run alongside of?

[Thrax]

The new OS that follows Vista.

[Byron172]

No rest for the wicked over at Microsoft...Vista hasn't even gone cold yet and they're planning it's funeral:D

[Snarkasm]

No, they're building a better release to try and fix all the complaints about Vista.

[Sonorous]

From what I understand, Apple won't open their operating system to non-apple hardware because they don't have the means to provide support to such a huge customer base. If Apple where to open it's os to every hardware maker and only 1/8th of the pc users switched, there would still be a massive need for support, for both the consumer side and hardware makers side. Besides, the iTunes store and iPod is where apple makes most of their money right?

[Byron172]

I know where you're coming from but surely the support costs would be relative to the extra profits that they would make from selling their product to an extra 12% of the market......

[mondi]

Realistically, how many people do you think would actually pay for osx86

[kryyst]

I suppose this is one way they remain more exclusive - they can separate the wheat from the chaff because only a real enthusiast will shell out the dosh for the whole kit.......ah well, on to Linux I suppose.

For the majority of mac ownsers it's not so much about enthusiasts as it is about ease of mind. You buy a mac it works. You buy it and you use it works and just keeps working until the day it dies. It's like buying an appliance.

It sounds cliche but generally speaking when you get a mac you don't have to mess with it and it'll typically last you for years without needing to deal with upgrades or anything else. It's a pure out of the box experience.


It'd be nice to be able to have a Windows, an OS/X and a Linux OS all on the same PC so that you could boot into whichever took your fancy at the time but it seems like too much trouble. Thank the computer gods for KVM switches.......:D

You can do that on the new imac's easily. They even have a built in program to install windows into it's own partition. Throw in parallels into that frame as well and it's a great multi-os experience. You can also add linux into it as well, though that is more tricky.

You can do the same on a PC, but you need to do a hackintosh setup and that will work with varried success depending on your hardware.

[mertesn]

Realistically, how many people do you think would actually pay for osx86
If it ran unmodified on my PC, I would. My biggest reason is simple: I want to write iPhone applications.
If Apple's hardware costs were more realistic I'd have a real Mac (probably a Mini or iMac) but until I get a promotion it's a VMWare Mac for me...

[Byron172]

I think plenty of people would pay for a version of OS/X that is developed by Apple to run on a PC with guaranteed stability. I 'm not suggesting that people would pay for a hacked version of osx86 though.....

I think Kryyst's suggestion of running Windows on a Mac is a great idea, but how hard is it to get Ubuntu or Mandriva running on this type of set up?

[kryyst]

This is how I have my imac setup.

First I replaced the base 160gig hdd with a 40gig hdd (I should note that this is not a simple upgrade and it does void your warranty). I also upgraded from 1gig of ram to 3gigs which does make all the difference when you are running vm's.

I should note that I first attached the 400gig hdd externally then used carbon copy to transfer my original osx install to it. Then I didn the harddrive swap.

I used the bootcamp program and it created a 60gig partition on the imac and you follow the promps put in the windows cd when it asks and it installs windows on it. You can then dual boot into the windows partition when you want.

Because the windows partition is 60gig it's got to be NTFS, OSX can read, but not write to ntfs so from osx the partition is viewable but not writable. However there is a third party program that allows you to write to ntfs.

I then installed paralleles and told it to use my windows bootcamp partition and made a windows virtual machine of it. So now from OS X I can run my bootcamp version of windows when i don't need major graphics (bascially non-gaming) or I can reboot into windows if I want to run games, but in either case it's the same version of windows installed on that 60 gig partition.

I then created a linux virtual machine in os x. I could have split up that 60 gig partition and installed a linux partition into it so it'd tripple boot at the startup, but I don't see a need. The only need to boot into windows is for full direct x parallels only supports up to DX 8. Linux doesn't use direct x so there are no graphic limitations when it's running as a virtual machine.

Also the 3 gigs of ram is key. With 3 gigs of ram the host OS (os x) and any virtual machine I'm running all run happily together. With less then 3 gigs of ram you notice some lag, which may be annoying.

On other option is to use an external drive and just put your other OS's on it and boot to the external drive. Imac's play very well with external boot devices and are happy to boot off them without any problems. But if you are doing anything intensive you probably want to have it mounted through the firewire connector and not usb2.

[Byron172]

Thanks for the run thorugh kryyst, I look forward to giving it a go......whatever happens it seems that I will need to shell out some hardearned for a mac if I want to have a (reliable and stable) selection of the 3 operating systems. Since writing this post I have got my hands on an old Mac notebook. I have loaded my copy of Panther onto that without any trouble but it will definitely need some extra ram and a larger HDD.....it's given me a good taste of the OS though and I like it a lot.....I'll keep ya posted once I delve into this further, thanks again for your help......:)

[stoopid]

Great thread, definitely added to my limited knowledge about the Mac and Panther. I had toyed with the idea of getting a Mac PC but decided against it after asking a Mac-addict friend who knew about the limitatons discussed here. Maybe I''ll just pickup something used, toss in some extra RAM, and give it a spin.

[Sonorous]

To be honest I think there should be an OSX or Apple section on the site (or atleast a subforum) for all of us apple fan boys.