Is this a good computer case?

[Dodger]

I hate to start multiple threads asking which hardware's the best but here it goes...

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-133-116&catalog=7&manufactory=BROWSE&depa=1

As far as I know this baby comes decked out with 5 thermaltake smart fan 2 case fans. Here are the specs...

Case Type:Xaser II Tower
Color: Black
Material: 1.0mm SECC Japan Steel
Drive Bays: 5.25'' x4,3.5''(External) x2, 3.5''(Internal) x4
Expansion Slot: 7
Front Ports: USB2.0 x2,IEEE1394 x1
Power Supply: N/A
Cooling System: 80mm Fan Front x2,Rear x2,Side Panel x1
Mainboard Compatibility: Standard ATX,Micro ATX
Dimensions: 20.6''x8.1''x18.6''

So, is it good, bad, or just plain ugly? Total honesty is greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[Thrax]

The airflow in the case is thoroughly contradictory; that is there are several spots where air just runs into one another and destroys a healthy air pattern over components.

It's also extremely heavy, and I think "Tacky" is too loose a word to describe it.

[Dodger]

I'm not going for looks. Not to mention I could use a good work out...

Anyway, aside from my personel problems, what makes you say the airflow contradicts itself?

[madmat]

The fans are 80mmx25mm silent fans not the smart fan2's and with a 92mm blowhole in the roof added to it the airflow's not terribly bad.
As far as the styling's concerned, it's one of thos things you either love or hate, I've yet to meet someone that thought they were just "ok".

[Dodger]

It's all good... silent fans can cool my computer down anyday.

[Thrax]

The side case fan; it disrupts the airflow from bottom front to top back.

But beyond that;

The case is a black chieftec dragon series with a Vantec rheobus, and a new door.

Why don't you just get a chieftec dragon and a vantec rheobus and save some money? That's how it works in my mind.

:)

[madmat]

I had an Antec 1080 that I windowed (with that same shape about 2 months before those hit the market) that I put a 120mm fan where the 80mm fan is in the window and a 92mm blowhole I added later and after putting the blowhole in the roof my case temps dropped considerably but without the top 92 the airflow was worse with the 120 running than without it.

[Dodger]

So, I should order a 92mm case fan along with the case?

[celcho]

my translation of thrax:

the case sucks and is a waste of money. it is like a ricer.

i agree with the guy. looks like a transformer (robots in disguise)

[Dodger]

I'll say it again...

I DON'T CARE IF THE THING LOOKS LIKE JANIT REENO JUST TELL ME WHAT KIND OF AIRFLOW AND SUCH IT OFFERS!!!

[Thrax]

Dodger had this to say
So, is it good, bad, or just plain ugly? Total honesty is greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[Dodger]

Thrax had this to say
The side case fan; it disrupts the airflow from bottom front to top back.

But beyond that;

The case is a black chieftec dragon series with a Vantec rheobus, and a new door.

Why don't you just get a chieftec dragon and a vantec rheobus and save some money? That's how it works in my mind.

:)

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-125-262&depa=1&section=3 ?

I just typed that in there for show. I really don't care what it looks like.

[madmat]

Well, that's a decent case but you won't have airflow over the PCI/AGP like you would with the fan in the side window, but as I said earlier with a fan in the side it really does need a blowhole to clean up the airflow and even without it (side fan) a blowhole still will help to remove the hot air trapped up by the optical drives.

[Dodger]

Alright, so as I asked before, should I simply order a 92mm fan along with the case?

[TheLostSwede]

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-129-120&catalog=7&manufactory=BROWSE&depa=1

Same case, same place, same time, same price and whatnot but WITH a desent 400W psu and WITHOUT the shines as you stated you dont care about.

I would choose

http://www.mackanz.com/flower.jpg

but then again, i don't care about looks either :/



(JK)

[Dodger]

;D

Ownage.

Seriously though, the case has a few flaws...

1. no side panel fan option (if this is really considered a flaw)
2. no ''blow hole''
3. no idea what kind of fans it uses. That's a risk I really don't want to take.

[TheLostSwede]

It uses a bunch of 80mm fans. 4 or more at least.

You CAN buy a separate door with window and/or a sidehole if you want later on. But i can tell you it doesn't help at all unless you funnel COLD air inside that hole. I have tested it with mighty powerful fans. No dice. Another thing with the Xaser which is the mother of all feckups IMO is that the harddrive mounts are rotated so that the cable mount is from the door-side if you know what i mean. Handy som would say but peeps with a SATA-PATA adapter won't hussah though. Can't mount those harddrives. No chance with the door on. That was at least on the reviewed case i saw a couple of months back. Maybe they have changed that now but i doubt it.

[Geeky1]

Thrax, it's no worse than the Antec SX10x0 series, (which isn't all that great IMO, anyhow, but...)

Dodger, what did you want in terms of noise and size?

[Dodger]

As long as it's ATX and under 100 bucks i'll buy it.

EDIT: so far, no one has mentioned anything that can't fixed with wrong with a 92mm fan in the case (other than looks). So, if no one mentions any other flaws i'll go ahead and order tomorrow or so...

[Geeky1]

That case doesn't take 92mm fans. I'll see what I can find and post it. You willing to modify a case a bit, or do you just want something that you can drop everything in and go, even if it's not as good as one that you've modified a bit?

[madmat]

I had suggested putting a 92 in the roof as a blowhole to help clean up the airflow as I had done in my past Antec 1080pp.

[Mr_Bojingles]

celcho had this to say
my translation of thrax:

the case sucks and is a waste of money. it is like a ricer.

i agree with the guy. looks like a transformer (robots in disguise)

Whats wrong with tranformers?! ;)

I have the thermaltake lanfire vm2000. I like the case myself and it gets the cooling done despite its weird airflow pattern.

BUT before anyone comes up and flames me for wasting my money on a supposedly bad case, hold up. Because shipping mistakes are the best :D

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-133-117&catalog=7&manufactory=BROWSE&depa=1

[fatcat]

Chieftec Case...
$46.00 with FREE shipping...

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-125-264&catalog=7&manufactory=BROWSE&depa=1

[fatcat]

forgot pic... :doh:
http://images10.newegg.com/productimage/11-125-264-09.JPG

[Geeky1]

FatCat, that's the same basic case as the one he posted, except it's cheaper.

It's got the same problems. It's a decent case, but I'm not particularly fond of it. I've worked with it before, and, like I said, it's OK, but it's nothing to write home about.

[Dodger]

So, what do you reccomend? My budget it 100 dollars.

Geeky1 had this to say
That case doesn't take 92mm fans. I'll see what I can find and post it. You willing to modify a case a bit, or do you just want something that you can drop everything in and go, even if it's not as good as one that you've modified a bit?

I suppose, if I absolutely have to i'll mod the case a bit. Maybe add a blowhole and such.

[Geeky1]

http://directron.com/fullall.html

Any of the Matrix/Dragon cases on there that have 6 cd bays; they're identical to the Antec SX1240, which was discontinued some time ago. The ones with 4 cd bays will be identical to the one FatCat posted, except for the color and bezel style.

Other than that, the Antec SX-835II (from Newegg) is better than the larger, more common Chieftec/Chenming/Antec etc. version, and it's similar to a SX1240 that's had the top 3 CD bays chopped off and 1 hard drive cage removed. The 3 intake fans on the 835/1240 style cases allow for better cooling than the more common, sx1040/1080 style cases, such as the one that FatCat posted.

[drasnor]

I'm very fond of my Lian Li PC-7. You might be able to find it for less than $100 (I did a long time ago) since it's technically Lian Li's budget model. It's all aluminum and has a simple straight-through airflow pattern where there's two 80mm fans blowing through the hard drives, where the air then moves diagonally across the motherboard to the single 80mm exhaust and the 80mm exhaust on my PSU. Number intake fans = number outake fans so the case doesn't pressurize.

http://redeyepc.com/Merchant2/graphics/custom/product/CAS-03200-00_full.jpg
CrazyPC has it for $94.25 (http://www.crazypc.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=120199&Product_Code=81329)

It's all aluminum so it doesn't weigh hardly anything, and comes without a PSU so you aren't stuck with some junker Sparkle or Fortron PSU after you install a decent Antec or Enermax PSU of sufficient strength to power whatever you put in it.

-drasnor :fold:

[Geeky1]

Drasnor, I'll bet that that LianLi has positive pressure problems, actually. Most power supplies have thermally controlled fans. Your PS fan is likely moving <20cfm most of the time, so it's effectiveness as an exhaust fan is negligible at best.

1 80mm exhaust is passable for a modern (p4/athlon) system, but far from ideal. Why Lian-Li and Coolermaster insist on using a single fan still is beyond me, but they do, and that's one of the reasons I don't like their cases.

I also don't like aluminum cases because the Lian-Li I worked on had had a lot of the screw holes stripped; the thumbscrews are steel, the case is aluminum. If you're not extremely careful when threading those screws in, you'll destroy the threads. The cases should have their screw holes lined with steel, similar to the way cars with aluminum engine blocks sometimes have steel cylinder liners to protect the block, but that's either too expensive or makes too much sense for Lian-Li or Coolermaster to do it.

Bottom line:
IMO, Lian-Li and Coolermaster are poorly designed (excepting the PC-70 & larger Lian-Lis), overpriced cases that are intended for people who care more about how their computer looks and/or how much it weighs than they do about temperatures.

[drasnor]

Shrug. I don't know what you're talking about, since I've never had any of those problems and it runs pretty cool (42 C processor temp on my 1.8GHz P4) even with my rats nest of cables. I halfway-stripped a hard drive bracket hole, but I re-tapped the hole and all is well.

-drasnor :fold:

[Geeky1]

What is the case temperature, though? And what HSF are you using? Also, does the top of the case ever get warm at all (like after folding for a while)?

I've got some 1.7GHz Celeron systems at work, and they run ~38*C in Antec SLK-3700AMB cases (2 120mm fans; 1 intake, 1 exhaust) but that doesn't mean they're good cases. Far from it, in fact. I've got one that I bought because I thought they were decent, and it is one of the worst cases I've ever used. I had to put 2 80mm blowholes in it just to get halfway decent cooling out of it, and even with those, the only system I'll trust that case to cool is my 1.5GHz (1.3 OC'd) Celeron print server.

[drasnor]

Intel stock sink, folds 24/7. Of course the top of the case gets warm, but not like hot warm. Case temp is 23 C, ambient is 18.3 C.

I have a Chieftec and an Antec like the ones displayed earlier, and they run hotter by comparison with a dual 604e and a 1900+ respectively. The top of those cases feel hotter to me anyway.

Bottom line: YMMV.

-drasnor :fold:

[Geeky1]

Of course the top of the case gets warm

Hmm. The only case I've ever had the top get noticeably warm on is the SLK; and now that I've modded the blowholes into it, it doesn't get warm, either. :D The reason it gets warm is because hot air rises, and mid-towers, ones with single exhaust fans in particular, have a tendency to trap that heat in the pocket of air around the optical drives and the PS.

The second fan does a lot to counteract that, but the best solution is to either put a blowhole in, or get a bigger case. I consider any case where the top is noticeably warmer than the bottom to have poor airflow, but that's just me.

But, as you said... YMMV.

[Straight_Man]

Well, lessee-- for a top blowhole, a reasonable volume of airflow can be gotten with a high efficiency 80x25 mm fan. Top panel is not a slide-off, you would get to drill out come pop-rivets and replace them, and you would need the following to go along with it:

a 2-fan PSU, simply to not be sucking air against the fan ariflow that is trying to cool PSU.

An 80 mm Panflo, Delta, or YS-Tech fan that has a rheostat on it or can be run at variable voltage. The YS-Tech that svcompucycle sells can do this.

What they did was to cut out the top of a door for a Vantec controller, and then make edges that look semi-decent.

No, not a 92 mm, an 80 mm dual ball or hydro bearing fan. Need not have sense wire, but does need to spin up at 6-7 volts max and does need to be running full steam at 12-12.5 Volts, and dual-ball bearing fans or hydrobearings will do this. Sleeve bearings are no good for a variable voltage setup, too inefficient. No thicker than a 25mm though, or you will be blocking the vents in most PSUs.

There IS another way to do this, which is how I do my Antec cases:

TOP two bays get something other than burners, bottom two big bays get burners. Then you get the advantage of the back fans more, and the blowhole with a less volume-effective fan can not disturb PSU airflow and still suck remaining heat up out of case top without trying to reverse airflow through PSU. Get a PSU with good fans, though, TWO of them. Probably means a name brand PSU and not a generic as part of your system set bundle, probably a 480 Watt or 500 Watt. An AMD+P4 rated PSU will have extra umph in the 12 volt for what a P4 system would use for an accessory circuit pair, and I tap those for fans and do not use on mobo as most mobos do not need that lead (two yellos, 12 V, two returns, black, squareish connector with a tang on end, you DO use squeeze-on self-tapping atoumotive harness tapins on power lines for best results and being able to later use that connector if you want that.)

Since you are going to probably need to mod to get best results, would just get a Chieftec, myself, and a very good PSU with money savings. And buy fans by model, not by cost being lead determinator of what fan.

John.

[madmat]

I agree that an 80mm can be used for a top blowhole but in doing so to reach the same airflow as a 92mm fan it will be spinning faster and generating more noise which is why I suggest and used a 92mm fan for a top blowhole.
It will fit quite snugly in between the longest optical drive you care to put into that style of case at the top and the PSU with no problems at all

[Geeky1]

Madmat, I'd go for a 92mm blowhole too, actually. Although I do have a drive that is big enough that they would not fit in the top bay with a 92mm fan there; My old (Summer '01) Plextor 24/10/40a CD-RW is a full 8" long, and so it is actually too long to allow the use of a 92mm fan. However, new CD-RWs, like my LiteOns, are only 6" deep or so, and it shouldn't be a problem. So, unless he has an old optical drive that has to go in the top bay, it should be a non-issue.

By the way, if you're going to get a 92mm fan, get a Sunon KD1209PTB2; they flow 44cfm @ a rated 35dba, but in free air, they're basically silent.

[TheLostSwede]

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?DEPA=1&sumit=Go&description=11%2D125%2D609&searchdepa=1

Deal of the day from Newegg if you like the Chieftecs/Antecs etc.
Looks pretty ok and also have front usb and whatnot. $35 shipped is just too good to pass IMO.

[madmat]

That's a mighty sweet looking case Mack, great deal for the price.

[GHoosdum]

Mack, you evil evil man, now you have made me buy myself a $35 XMas present! Arg! ;)

[Dodger]

Ok, what if I ordered this (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-999-113&depa=1) fan along with this (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-133-116&depa=1) case, and simply modded the case to have a blow whole. And possibly even take the side case fan out. Would that fix the issues with this case?

[muddocktor]

How about this Antec SX835 case? (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-129-119&catalog=7&manufactory=BROWSE&depa=1) ? It comes with a 350 watt psu and I seem to remember Geeky saying that he preferred the airflow pattern of this series much better than the Antec 10XX/Chieftech/TT series that you were originally looking at. It's also only $82 and $18 shipping, which puts it exactly at your $100 limit. Also, it will give you a decent psu to have as a backup psu in case you have one go tits up.

[Straight_Man]

Geeky was right, although with that case I would use a fan behind the HDs in the swingout bay, blowing inward into case. I would put very high volume back fans in, and take the Antecs and use them for front fans. Three front, lower volume fans, and two higher volume exhaust fans so as not to get into a positive case pressure situation which is what happens when you blow air in more forcefully than it goes out. Second, more noise in back is not gonna balst your ears as much, and it is more likely to vent case right in a closed in situation. Avoid covering over top of case under a desk if you can, put it next to desk, about 7-9 inches out from wall (from back of case to wall (so air vents and flow between back of case and wall can bend easier and go upward). One more hint, if you have carpet, raise case on a wood rack (I use oak 2x2s, with short bottom pieces going across width of case, longer pieces on top, with pieces on top going front to back, glued and deck screwed together with about 2-1/2" deck screws screwed into predrilled holes) about 3" to 4" above floor to minimize dust coming bottom inward fan and clogging the intake port.

One disadvantage of this case is that the back fans will be blowing at a privacy or reinforcing panel on an average desk and you would get back pressure which would radically reduce outward airflow volume and thus net cooling, the taller case would let you have the fans a tib higher if you HAVE to put the computer under a desk.

John.