Xbox Live and kids.
I have a 13-year old son who is trying to convince me to let him get Xbox Live. He argues that "all of his friends have it" and that he'll only use the Xbox Live headset with his friends. I also have a son who is 20 and one of his friends says that they once got addicted to Xbox Live when they were in high school and that it did not end up well. My son also says that he'll pay for everything. I think he might get addicted, but he also might not. When he first got his xbox, he was only addicted for about a week and then the playing cooled down and now he only plays about an hour and a half a week (he got the Xbox 4 months ago). Any suggestions on letting him get it? Also, one of his best friends dads plays Call of Duty on Live and says that my son will not get addicted. All of my son's friends have also tried to convince me to let my son get live. Any ideas on what to do would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!
0
Comments
Talk to your son, work together to establish a set number of hours per week that he can play online, and set up the parental controls to enforce that. Once those run out, he has to go outside or do all the homework he's left piling up, but he agreed to that number of hours, and that's the key. If you talk to him and agree on a number, he's demonstrated commitment to that number of hours, and can't complain when he uses it up.
And, as Thrax illustrated, you are, indeed, the parent. You can always just yank the ethernet cable, if it really comes down to it, or ban the XBox's address from getting to the internet if your router has those kind of controls.
There's no point in anybody getting all upset over a video game, so just discuss it with him like an adult and see where it gets you.
YOU ARE THE PARENT. YOU determine what your child can and cannot do on the internet. You NEED to be more involved. Ever think about sitting down and playing WITH your son online? See what kind of environment it is?
I'll not sugarcoat it: People online are jerks. Your son will hear racism, swearing, and innuendo. However, he's 13. He's old enough to handle it if you trust him to make the right decisions.
I cannot stress this enough: PARENTS NEED TO GAME WITH THEIR KIDS. My parents were absolutely ignorant about my online activities when I was 13, and I was exposed to things they probably would have flipped their lids about. My kids and I have an exceptionally trusting relationship, because I know the people they game with-- because I game with them too.
You can't just give your kid the keys to the wide world of the internet and say "off you go" - you HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THE CULTURE to be an effective parent.
I'm eager to see Preacher pipe in on this- he's also a gaming dad on this site, and his son is 13 and games with us. He is a very well-adjusted kid, because dad is there to set parameters and guide him.
Let me say this: Welcome to Icrontic. You have found a website full of mature, kind people. This is a community that I am literally raising my children in, and by that I mean I would let my kids be guided by anyone in this village. The reason I feel this comfortable with this community is because I am involved in it.
There are good and bad. I'll give you an example: over a hundred people on this website play a game called Team Fortress 2 together, online, almost every night. I let my kids play with them, because I know they are all good people.
There is another server that some of the members here play on, that is full of hateful and mean people. I would never let my kids play on that server. How do I know the difference? Because I got my ass on the other server, played with them a few times, learned their culture, and said no way. I don't want my kids to hear people telling them to visit horrible violent porno sites or see sprays of swinging dicks. I got involved, and made a choice. I found a group of gamers that I would trust my kids with, and then gave my kids the freedom to grow within that community.
Anything less is just lazy parenting.
I have a 13-year old son who is trying to convince me to let him get coloring books. He argues that "all of his friends have them" and that he'll only draw things with his friends. I also have a son who is 20 and one of his friends says that they once got addicted to coloring books when they were in grade school and that it did not end up well. My son also says that he'll pay for everything. I think he might get addicted, but he also might not. When he first got his crayons, he was only addicted for about a week and then the coloring cooled down and now he only draws about an hour and a half a week (he got the crayons 4 months ago). Any suggestions on letting him get them? Also, one of his best friends dads draws trees and rainbows at work and says that my son will not get addicted. All of my son's friends have also tried to convince me to let my son get coloring books. Any ideas on what to do would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!
<!-- / message --> <!-- attachments --> <!-- / attachments --> <!-- sig --> <!-- / sig -->
<!-- ic-postbit-content -->
I can understand why you might speak to people who are tech savy and game if you are interested in technical help or understanding more about the world of XBOX Live. For example, you want to know which games would be fun and appropriate for a boy who is 13 and likes Basketball and cars. Or your XBOX is broken and you'd like to fix it yourself.
However, if you have earnest concerns about whether video games are addictive, perhaps you should speak with a medical professional on the topic instead of gamers. Your pedatrician, for example, who I'm sure has answers and suggestions regarding your concern. It's highly likely that the doctor will give you similar answers to those you have found above, but I personally think a medical doctor is a more appropriate person to speak with regarding the health of your son, which is really what you seem concerned about.
A psychological addiction is a very specific thing, and only occurs when three things are all true: A person engages in something habitually, that thing negatively effects their life in their opinion, and they are unable to stop.
For example, say you have two guys who play WoW for 40 hours a week, and both of their girlfriends leave them because of it. Guy A honestly thinks, "meh, I like WoW better than her anyway, so I don't care." Guy B thinks, "Oh no! My girlfriend is leaving, I really do love her more than this game, but I still can't stop"
Guy B in this example is an addict.
Guy A just like WoW, and didn't like his girlfriend very much. He is not an addict.
It has nothing to do with how much they use the game, or even what happens because of it. Psychological addiction is a compulsion to use despite an honest desire to stop. Please don't perpetuate the misuse of the word.
/semi-related pedantic rant
This is perhaps, fortuitously, the single greatest place to ask for intelligent, experienced opinions about the pitfalls of Internet gaming and children because we've all been there and back again and we're generally a bunch of nice, well-balanced people (it's rare to find this many nice people in the same place, trust me).
Ask your pediatrician about how to talk to your kids about sex, not how to talk to them about Internet culture and gaming.
What Brian said x10: Gaming addiction is a combination of lazy parents and kids with no willpower or motivation. Either you care enough to know what's going on or you don't.
affects
/even less related pedantic rant
As for addiction, that's a load of hogwash. There is no dependence, no change in brain chemistry outside of a small adrenaline rush when playing games. Your son's friend probably just misused the word addicting like so many others.
Don't give a list of ultimatums on the Xbox Live usage. Have a discussion where your young one determines how they will identify if something is inappropriate and how to react to those situations.
Also, ask him how he thinks having this new feature is going to affect him and how it could affect other things, like friends, school, etc. Guide him a bit so he's coming up with the rules and what needs to be done if a rule gets broken. If he helps set the guidelines (not full reign, but guided), he knows what they are (you should also write them down) and he'll know that he had a hand in their creation.
Sure, you may need to lay down the law every once and a while... but for the most part, he can't complain since he help build out the structure and knew what he was getting into.
Murtagh,
I have a 14 year old son who is a passionate gamer as am I. Of course, he also runs track, is an avid reader, consistently makes the honor roll, and is a general pleasure to be around (when he is not in full "hormonic", omniscient, omnipotent teenager mode). He is a great kid and we are very proud of his accomplishments and his drive to be a law enforcement officer. I chose a different tack from my parents who said gaming was a waste, rarely played with me, and said it would make me blind. None of which has happened after college and nearly two decades in the US Navy. The irony is my daily job is very much like playing a computer game with severe consequences for me if I fail or for the enemy if I succeed. I am convinced my performance, reflexes, situational awareness, and ability to multi-task was directly developed and substantially improved by computer games.
We have three computers and a PS3 in our house (similar to Xbox Live) and game on all four. He has access to Home on the PS3 as well as the internet. However, we do place some restrictions on his use of the PS3 and computers:
1. His ability to game is TOTALLY dependent on his grades and being active in two extracurricular activities (Track and Computer Club). As long as he maintains a B average, he gets to play on the computer or PS3 AFTER homework gets completed. At the first indication of bad grades, access to the computer or PS3 quickly declines to nothing.
2. There are NO computers or TVs in our kid's bedrooms so we can monitor their use. That is where the books are!
3. We have a web blocker on each computer. I could really care less about him seeing nudity, but I don't want him exposed to hard core porn, racism, sexism, and all the other ilk on the internet.
4. Other than gifts for holidays and birthdays, he pays for his games out of his own allowance, making him appreciate their worth.
With these basic controls in place and well-known, we are confident he has the freedom to explore and question without seeing things he is not ready for or that should be discussed in a private family forum.
While many of the larger issues have already been addressed by my distinguished Icrontian colleagues, but I would like to add my perspective:
1. Gaming addiction: People get addicted to substances, sex, exercise, cars, motorcycles, etc...yet games get blamed for EVERYTHING including the general decline of our young/our civilization/the Columbine massacre. It's ludicrous. Gaming is just like any other pastime. It should be done in moderation. It does have substantial (critical thinking, hand-eye coordination, etc) positives unlike TV and many other pastimes.
2. "All my friends do it" Argument: I could care less. After trying and failing multiple times, this vein of discussion goes nowhere in our house. WE do what WE think is best for our family.
3. Controls: I don't know the Xbox well, but the PS3 has extensive parental controls. Use them. It looks like Microsoft recognizes our collective desire to guide our kids into adulthood:
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/support/familysettings/default.htm
In the end, I'd allow him access to Xbox live . Express in very clear, unambiguous language what your expectations of him are and set rules for him to use Xbox live. Warn him about what the consequences are if he stops getting good grades, participating in extracurricular activities, or hanging out with other teens. You should even consider drafting a "personal contract" that writes out in simple language what your expectations are. I thought the contract was a silly, simple idea until I saw its power to make a C student into an honor roll one several years ago.
Your son WILL learn in our society if he has the right to do something, he also has the responsibility to do it responsibly. If he violates your trust or tests you, then take the right away and return it when he learns to be more responsible. However, if you expect the best out of people, you usually get that.
I'm stepping down now of my pulpit, but I still can't figure out why everyone calls me, Preacher...
P.S. Blame Lincoln for my diatribe!
I think you definitely hit on a hot issue here and I hope you don't perceive any of our comments aggressively or as backlash. This really is one of the most thoughtful groups of people you could discuss this with and because we're a group with very careful parents and good guys we often hear the culture around us miss-perceive video games as violent, addictive and a waste of time. We as gamers get called out and blamed every time something like Columbine happens regardless of the facts and I don't bring that up to be crass, I live in Littleton, CO not 10 miles from Columbine. It's hard not to be defensive when the things we've chosen to spend our time on is said to responsible for horrific tragedies or at best an addictive waste of time. Certainly there are cases when games can encourage violence and can be addictive but there are many other cases where gaming is a completely positive experience and that's why the community is encouraging you to play with your son so that you can not only prevent him from going to the places or playing the games that aren't positive for him but also learn to use good games as an opportunity to connect with each other and discuss the positives of a game.
Let's take a role playing game like Mass Effect for the Xbox 360 and other platforms, like many games today it gives you the choices to be good or bad in how you play the game. Sit down with your son and play through the game and talk to him about the moral choices you're forced to make and why you believe one choice is better then another. You'll have the opportunity to talk about loyalty, duty, sacrifice, justice, political relations, bioethics and many more great conversation pieces.
What I can't recommend strongly enough is reading the book Grand Theft Childhood, it's written by a husband and wife who founded the Harvard Medical School Center for Mental Health and Media and really explored all the positive effects, negative effects, myths and truths about gaming very carefully and they started from an unbiased position having never played games themselves. It's not too long of a book and I really wish every parent who has a child interested in gaming would read through it.
Race, I think you have a good point here but I also feel like the vast majority of pediatricians won't have any real experience with the issue, a psychologist might be a much better choice but I do feel like our culture biases gaming so badly that it's hard to get a good response from a doctor because they may approach it with as much bias as this community has but with less experience. That's exactly why I recommended the book Grand Theft Childhood because it's a very unbiased source that really digs in and as really intelligent psychologists I trust their conclusions.