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SPOILERS HERE - StarWars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi Post Viewing Extravaganza - SPOILERS HERE

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Comments

  • Cliff_ForsterCliff_Forster Baltimore, MD Icrontian

    Thematically Finn is a mirror to Han. I know Finn isn't cool like Han, but from a thematic standpoint, the reluctant hero, that's Finn. He's your Huckleberry.

    The Del Toro character might mirror Lando a bit better. Somewhat selfish guy that isn't all bad. You know it when he gives Rose her necklace back. Maybe in the third film they will get back to him and have that tension, a guy that knows the ins and outs of the arms business, maybe he can be a double agent if he can earn the trust of the Rebels.

  • Cliff_ForsterCliff_Forster Baltimore, MD Icrontian

    @Linc said:

    @Cliff_Forster said:
    don't you feel a little ripped off that you didn't have your farewell to that character. An exit fit for a hero?

    Your criticisms of this movie seem to be like 80% about your meta view of how Star Wars should go in your head.

    You trollin....

  • Cliff_ForsterCliff_Forster Baltimore, MD Icrontian

  • RyanMMRyanMM Ferndale, MI Icrontian

    I think the biggest reason some people are going to hate this movie is because it has very different things to say about what being a hero means.

    This writeup is fantastic.

    http://www.denofgeek.com/us/movies/star-wars/269657/toxic-masculinity-is-the-true-villain-of-star-wars-the-last-jedi

  • Cliff_ForsterCliff_Forster Baltimore, MD Icrontian
    edited Dec 2017

    @RyanMM said:
    I think the biggest reason some people are going to hate this movie is because it has very different things to say about what being a hero means.

    This writeup is fantastic.

    http://www.denofgeek.com/us/movies/star-wars/269657/toxic-masculinity-is-the-true-villain-of-star-wars-the-last-jedi

    I don't think many people dislike it for this. Most fans seem pretty cool with the expanded role of women, many men are completely delighted about it. Honestly, Star Wars has always had this element, it is being expanded but it is not new. We all know the boys and wookie are gonna die on that Death Star without Leia. Leia picks up a gun, tells you when you are gonna get us all killed and braces the trash compactor door.

    @RyanMM Not everything ties back to a morality based politcal disussion. That article is not entirely off base, but to say it's the reason audience reception is not as favorable as critics is some leftist elite hipster nonsense. This is dismissive of people who have very valid issues with the film.

    For me as it stands right now only Attack of the Clones ranks lower for me. It isn't because of my "Toxic Masculinity".

  • RyanMMRyanMM Ferndale, MI Icrontian

    Not everything does, but considering the critiques I've seen thus far, that article definitely underscores one of the more common reasons.

  • pseudonympseudonym Michigan Icrontian

    I thought it was decent, but need to see it again.

    I think I just really didn't like the zero backstory on Snoke and I really, really, REALLY wanted a Luke asskicking fest, ala Vader in Rogue 1. It was good as it was, but just a little fanservice...

    Remove the casino scene, flesh out Phasma and Snoke a bit more and I'm probably happy. I think that casino scene was ok as it was, but I think the time could have been used better.

  • d3k0yd3k0y Loveland, OH Icrontian

    My biggest issue was that nothing really moved forward.
    Engineer girl fell in love with Fin in 18 hours? No backstory with Snoke. Luke wants kind of meh. Casino scene was unnecessary. Dark side island was confusing? Leia being a sudden force wizard which apparently protects against extreme exposure and decompression. Rey doesn't actually learn anything about the force. Since when did the force actually balance itself between users. Mind meld is silly. Can you mind meld someone you've never met?

  • Cliff_ForsterCliff_Forster Baltimore, MD Icrontian

    I think that's an interesting observation about the Rose / Finn moment. I'm not sure she is romantically head over heels for him, but the way she is presented, I connected with it. At the beginning, like Holy shit, you are the Finn that did all that awesome stuff last week, you are my hero. Well imagine you are shy, a nerd, not popular, romance always escapes you, then suddenly you are thrust into a situation where you can impress a person that is out of your league as we say, and you succeed, big time.... She is trying to impress him, she wants to be noticed by him... To me, best moment of the whole film. Think of her less as a silly girl with a crush, and more as a socially awkward nerd that just wants to be noticed. They are not getting married, she just went in for a kiss.

  • GnomeQueenGnomeQueen The Lulz Queen Mountain Dew Mouth Icrontian
    edited Dec 2017

    I'm rewatching the force awakens and whenever I see Carrie Fisher hug/interact lovingly with someone I cry.

    PirateNinja
  • PirateNinjaPirateNinja I don't know how to not Icrontian

    After watching it I felt that I would be ok with what it was if this was just a necessary stepping stone to an incredible third movie. But I really had a hard time with the humor, the pace, and how things went with Luke. If two years from now the next one is bad, I'm really going to be mad at this one. Overall, it seemed like an attempt to meet the conflicting goals of a room full of different producers. The fan fare was like a quilt where you could rationally see the conformity between squares, but it didn't feel natural.

    Near the end, I was laughing because I felt I had to. Sort of like just wrapping up the set of a comedian who didn't vibe right with the audience even after some initial success. The Poe vs General Hugs scene laid the groundwork for the entire movie. Hey. Skywalker is going to die, but isn't this a gas? It was really funny, but I wish they would have left the light hearted nature there, at the door. Instead, let the emotional attachment I have to the jedi I grew up with end with real heart, instead of winks and one liners.

    It was a good movie. It had the potential to be way more than that. It had a tough act to follow.

  • AlexDeGruvenAlexDeGruven Not as tall as Bobby Tallbeer. Twilight Sparkle is overrated. Meechigan Icrontian

    Looks like I'll have a repeat viewing Wednesday evening.

    Things I'll be watching out for:

    • Benicio's character. I'm sure there's more to him that I missed on the first view, that will hopefully bring him back for Ep9+
    • Phasma's ending. Looking for clues as to whether she'll be there in 9+. Hoping maybe she's (part of) the big bad that ultimately brings the end of the FO
    • Any tells in Kylo Ren when he's telling Rey about her parents. I'm sure he can see the truth. Not 100% confident he was being honest with her. Much as I like the idea of her being a complete nobody, ala Anakin, there's always the possibility she isn't.
  • Cliff_ForsterCliff_Forster Baltimore, MD Icrontian

    I am 100% sure Ben Solo ia telling Rey the truth. The scene with the broom at the end cements it. Everyone can be special, in the case of Rey, the force choose her, unlocked her abilities when the balace drifted too far to darkness.

  • AlexDeGruvenAlexDeGruven Not as tall as Bobby Tallbeer. Twilight Sparkle is overrated. Meechigan Icrontian

    I'm about 80% in agreement. If only because I'm sure that Ben/Kylo's immense power was brought about through bloodline.

  • MiracleManSMiracleManS Chambersburg, PA Icrontian

    I can't help but see Rey as the opposite Anakin at this point and its beautiful.

  • GnomeQueenGnomeQueen The Lulz Queen Mountain Dew Mouth Icrontian

    I reeeeeeally want Rey to be a nobody, but there's also decent evidence to support her being a Palpatine or Kenobi. Could go any way any this point.

  • Cliff_ForsterCliff_Forster Baltimore, MD Icrontian
    edited Dec 2017

    Anakin is described as a virgin birth, but it's hinted that Palpatine may of had something to do with planting him. Think about Anakin's greatest weakness, his attachments, his inability to let go. What if the Force magically, intuitively knows for a light warrior to fight back the darkness, the child must be unattached to not fall into the same traps. Maybe the force willed Rey to have cruddy parents as a way to set her free?

    I'm at peace with that reveal, she isn't a Kenobi or Skywalker, she is just a girl that the force selected to restore balance.

  • GnomeQueenGnomeQueen The Lulz Queen Mountain Dew Mouth Icrontian
  • DontCallMeKelsoDontCallMeKelso Kelso 'The Great Asshole' San Jose, CA Icrontian

    I have a feeling Ep9 is gonna retcon some stuff that was said in 8. I think JJ will go back to his original story ideas; the more I think about the future of the Skywalker storyline the more I think Rian sorta jumped the shark on some story elements that might have been previously laid out.

  • GnomeQueenGnomeQueen The Lulz Queen Mountain Dew Mouth Icrontian

    @DontCallMeKelso said:
    I have a feeling Ep9 is gonna retcon some stuff that was said in 8. I think JJ will go back to his original story ideas; the more I think about the future of the Skywalker storyline the more I think Rian sorta jumped the shark on some story elements that might have been previously laid out.

    I feel like he can't retcon all that much without ruining the continuity. I feel like the only thing he could really change is Rey's parentage. What else could he change?

  • AlexDeGruvenAlexDeGruven Not as tall as Bobby Tallbeer. Twilight Sparkle is overrated. Meechigan Icrontian

    Rey's parentage could be easy enough. Not unreasonable that Kylo would be playing a long-con to get her to do something he wants.

  • GnomeQueenGnomeQueen The Lulz Queen Mountain Dew Mouth Icrontian

    @AlexDeGruven said:
    Rey's parentage could be easy enough. Not unreasonable that Kylo would be playing a long-con to get her to do something he wants.

    Yea, changing that wouldn't be a retcon. I'm wondering wht else @DontCallMeKelso is referring to.

  • DontCallMeKelsoDontCallMeKelso Kelso 'The Great Asshole' San Jose, CA Icrontian

    I think we'll see Phasma again. Rey's lineage isn't going to be "nobody." Snoke had turned Ben and or something else was really going on when Luke thought about killing Ben but didn't. That's just off the top of my head. There's probably a few other things, but those are gonna be the big points. We were just talking about it at work and it really feels like Rian took characters and story that JJ had started and might have had a plan of where it was going to go and then just tossed that stuff to the side of the road and JJ is gonna have to go back and maybe fix some of it.

  • LincLinc Bard Detroit, MI Icrontian
    edited Dec 2017

    No one believed Vader was Luke's father either after Empire released.

    My position is there's no chance they revisit Rey's parentage. It's cannon. Done.

    Cliff_ForsterRyanMMCanti
  • LincLinc Bard Detroit, MI Icrontian

    @DontCallMeKelso said:
    I think we'll see Phasma again.

    Count the number of times that someone disappeared down a giant shaft / chute / throat in Star Wars that the character reappeared in the next movie. Not happening.

    Cliff_Forster
  • GnomeQueenGnomeQueen The Lulz Queen Mountain Dew Mouth Icrontian

    I wouldn't say that any of that is actually retconning. Phasma's disappearance is ambiguous and it's totally possible we'll see her again. I am thinking maybe she'll have some nice burn scars now and she and Kylo Ren can bond over it. Rey's parentage is also ambiguous, although I hope that it's true. I don't know why he'd change the Luke scene with Ben-- it seemed well done and appropriate.

  • primesuspectprimesuspect Beepin n' Boopin Detroit, MI Icrontian

    @Linc said:

    @DontCallMeKelso said:
    I think we'll see Phasma again.

    Count the number of times that someone disappeared down a giant shaft / chute / throat in Star Wars that the character reappeared in the next movie. Not happening.

    1

  • Cliff_ForsterCliff_Forster Baltimore, MD Icrontian

    And assuming the fall didn't kill Phasma because of her super armor (loved the blaster shot off it) and her general bad ass nature, didn't Holdo Ram into her ship at hyper speed like twenty minutes later? Phasma is probably dead, but look, they brought Darth Maul back after hacking him in half, and Leia is the new host of Space Ghost coast to coast so anything is possible.

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