A-600, AXP or A64 for a charity box?

AlohaSurferAlohaSurfer A little rock called O'ahu
edited December 2004 in Hardware
Aloha all!

I have an aging personal system which basically can't recognize any type of optical drive (CD-DVD) over 8X and am in need of some help. Is there an upgrade path or should I bite the bullet and build a new rig? Budget is a MAJOR consideration as I can only afford to save $100 a week and anything I buy has to last a long time.

The computer is and will continue to be used for the daily operations of a 501(c)(3) food charity - word processing /spreadsheets, Quickbooks accounting, creation of our upcoming website, video editing/DVD recording. In addition, I do dialup web surfing and Counter-Strike FPS shooters for fun. High-speed internet is not an option where we are now, but at a later date we may move to a real office with Roadrunner and at that point turn the machine into a Win2K3 Server (HTTP-SMTP). In case I didn't make it clear, this is MY box which I donate use of, along with my voluneer time, to the charity. Every dollar we bring in goes to our Food Bank programs feeding 1,200 families. The only way we are getting anything PC-wise is if I pay for it from night security work, or if it's donated.

So the question is: limp this Athlon 600 system along with piecemeal (BIOS?) upgrades, get a AXP, or go A64? Any and all advice is welcome. Budget is the primary factor, then durability (5+ years lifespan). For me, overclocking is NOT an option. Items which would be bought (new) are *'d.

Option 1) Current System Upgrades (if possible)
CPU: AMD Athlon 600mhz Slot A, stock Slot A cooler
Mobo: FIC SD-11 ATX (2x ATA-66, 1x AGP 2x, 5x PCI 2.1, 1x ISA. 2x USB 1.1)
RAM: 512MB (2x 172-pin 256mb PC-133 SDRAM DIMMs, 3rd slot doesnt work)
HD: Maxtor 40GB 5400 ATA-100 (running at ATA-66 pri master)
CD: Generic 8X EIDE CD-ROM (pri slave)
Video: Matrox G400 Dualhead 32MB AGP 2X Video (to 2 Sony Multiscan 15sf CRTs)
Addin Cards: USR Sportster ISA 56k/X2 Modem, Ensoniq AudioPCI 1370 chipset sound (pre-Creative buyout)
Case: Antec 300W Midtower ATX & P/S, no case fans at all.
OS: Win98 SE w-all patches possible
Problem: System will not recognize ANY CD-RW/DVD-ROM/DVD-RW drives over 8x speed, even on a AHA-2940UW. It will boot & show faster drives in POST and Safe Mode's Device Manager but hangs on regular boot splash screen. Need to add a DVD-RW or at least CD-RW ASAP. Also procesing for DVD video import/conversion/editing is very slow.

Option 2) Cannibalize current system and go AXP
*CPU: AMD Athlon XP 2800+ (Barton) 2.08Ghz Socket A OEM w/ Thermaltech Tornado 9 Copper Cooler & Arctic Silver 5 Heatsink Compound.
*Mobo: Abit NFS7-S Nforce2 Socket A (2x SATA/RAID 0-1, 2x ATA-133, 1x AGP 4-8x, 5x PCI 2.2, 6x USB 2.0, 2x 1394, 10/100, 5.1 Dolby AC97 sound)
*RAM: 1 GB (2x 512MB or 1x 1GB PC2700 184-pin DDR 333 FSB) not sure what brand yet
*HD: Samsung 160GB 7200 ATA-133 (pri master), Maxtor 40GB 5400 ATA-100 (pri slave -need for the data on it)
*CD: Sony DW-D22A 16x DVD+-RW ATAPI (sec master), Sony CRW-230ED 52x CD-RW ATAPI (sec slave)
Video: If you can use a AGP 2x in these new 4x/8x slots, Ill reuse the Matrox G400 cause of DualHead. If not I need the cheapest 'real gaming' card.
*Addin Cards: Encore PCI V.92 PCI Modem ($5 at NewEgg!! Is it OK?)
*Case: Rosewill 400W Midtower ATX & P/S, adding 2x 80mm case fans
*OS: WinXP Pro SP2 & all possible patches
Problem: Well, the bells and whistles are nice but theres a $700 price tag, more if I can't use existing video card. Research shows $50 more for the Antec case w/420W Silent Purepower box if needed. So many options, hard to determine what's necessary and what's fluff. Not using SATA/RAID, 1394 or 10/100 yet but may need them later.

Option 3) Cannibalize current system and go A64
*CPU: AMD Athlon 64 2800+ (NewCastle) 939-pin OEM w/ Thermaltech Tornado 9 Copper Cooler & Arctic Silver 5 Heatsink Compound.
*Mobo: Gigabyte GA-K8WS Nforce3 250 939-pin socket (2x SATA/RAID 0-1, 2x ATA-133, 1x AGP 4-8x, 5x PCI 2.2, 6x USB 2.0, 2x 1394, 10/100, AC97 sound)
*RAM: 1 GB (1x 1GB PC3000 184-pin DDR 400 FSB) not sure what brand yet
*HD: Samsung 160GB 7200 ATA-133 (pri master), Maxtor 40GB 5400 ATA-100 (pri slave -need for the data on it)
*CD: Sony DW-D22A 16x DVD+-RW ATAPI (sec master), Sony CRW-230ED 52x CD-RW ATAPI (sec slave)
Video: If you can use a AGP 2x in these new 4x/8x slots, Ill reuse the Matrox G400 cause of DualHead. If not I need the cheapest 'real gaming' card.
*Addin Cards: Encore PCI V.92 PCI Modem
*Case: Antec 420W Midtower ATX & Sile TruePower P/S, adding 2-3 80mm case fans
*OS: WinXP Pro SP2 or Win2K3 Server with all possible patches
Problem: The 64-bit flavor with better power supply is actually only $100 more, bringing the tag to about $800 if AGP 2x video is ok. But I fear going 64-bit is a total waste of money for the uses I have. I know its a performance hit not to utilize the SATA/RAID but theres simply no money for it. And I can add those drives, bigger CPUs,vidcap card, etc later on.

All OS upgrades cost us almost nothing through the MS charitable org's program and is something I CAN get the charity to pay for. I kinda know which way Im leaning (Option 2), but I'd hate it bad to buy something and get stuck.

Comments

  • GnomeWizarddGnomeWizardd Member 4 Life Akron, PA Icrontian
    edited December 2004
    if you can afford it go with A64
  • JimboraeJimborae Newbury, Berks, UK New
    edited December 2004
    You should be able to reuse the the Matrox card.
  • JimboraeJimborae Newbury, Berks, UK New
    edited December 2004
    If you're willing to buy over the net from somewhere like Newegg you can get a Amd64 3000 system for about $550 not including the operating system, graphics card & only 512mb which is enough for what you want to begin with.
  • JimboraeJimborae Newbury, Berks, UK New
    edited December 2004
    How about this for $527 before shipping. I don't think I've forgotten anything.

    Qty Product Description Unit Price Extended Price
    Cases (Computer Cases, ATX Form)

    ANTEC Solution Series Super Mid Tower Case with 350W Power Supply, Model "SLK3700AMB" - Retail
    Item# N82E16811129122
    Status: In Stock

    Save to Buy Later
    Remove Item

    $62.00

    $62.00

    Extended Warranty Coverage
    CD/DVD Burners (RW Drives)

    NEC 16X Double Layer DVD±RW Drive, Black, Model ND-3500A BK, OEM
    Item# N82E16827152032
    Status: In Stock

    Save to Buy Later
    Remove Item

    $62.99

    $62.99

    Extended Warranty Coverage
    CD/DVD ROM Drives

    MSI Black 16X DVD-ROM, Model MS-P8216S-050, Retail
    Item# N82E16827100037
    Status: In Stock

    Save to Buy Later
    Remove Item

    $25.00

    $25.00

    Extended Warranty Coverage
    Hard Drives

    Maxtor 160GB 7200RPM SATA Hard Drive, MODEL 6Y160M0, OEM Drive Only
    Item# N82E16822144322
    Status: In Stock

    Save to Buy Later
    Remove Item

    $89.96

    $89.96

    Extended Warranty Coverage
    Memory (System Memory)

    Corsair Value Select 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3200 - Retail
    Item# N82E16820145026
    Status: In Stock

    Save to Buy Later
    Remove Item

    $67.50

    $67.50

    Extended Warranty Coverage
    Modems

    Encore 56K V.92 Internal PCI Fax Modem(NetoDragon), Model ENF656-ESW-NDPR - Retail
    Item# N82E16825180003
    Status: In Stock

    Save to Buy Later
    Remove Item

    $5.25

    $5.25

    Extended Warranty Coverage
    Motherboards - AMD

    EPOX "EP-8KDA3I" NVIDIA nForce3 250 Chipset Motherboard For AMD Socket 754 CPU -RETAIL
    Item# N82E16813123225
    Status: In Stock

    Save to Buy Later
    Remove Item

    $64.50

    $64.50

    **This item is warranted through the product manufacturer only. what's this?
    Extended Warranty Coverage
    Processors

    AMD Athlon 64 3000+, 512KB L2 Cache 64-bit Processor - Retail
    Item# N82E16819103486
    Status: In Stock

    Save to Buy Later
    Remove Item

    $150.00

    $150.00

    Extended Warranty Coverage
    Extended Warranty: $ .00
    Product total: $527.20
    Enter Promotion Code: what's this? Shipping & Handling: $ .00
    Total (Before tax): $527.20
  • AlohaSurferAlohaSurfer A little rock called O'ahu
    edited December 2004
    Wow thanks Jimborae for taking the time to check that out. I see going 64 seems to be the way then, and I guess for the long term that makes sense. A few questions:

    - The reason you're seeing such a low cost is you haven't factored in shipping to Hawaii yet. I may have over-estimated but probably not by much. As for speed, USPS Priorty Mail (Insured) or FedEx Ground is all I need. I could get the case/PS locally and save on shipping (maybe)

    - Is using the 754-pin A64 limiting or will they continue production of 754 & 939 pin Athlon 64 CPU's in the future?

    - Great idea! I can get the MSI DVD-ROM and use the second drive as just a player, which keeps all burning in the DVD+-RW. =)

    - Is there better results with the NEC DVD+-RW burner than the Sony? The last burner I had was a Plextor 8x SCSI-2 and the one thing I value is stable burns.

    - Is 350W really enough power? I see discussions around here (motherboards area) where a better power supply made all the difference. I'll list the system as you outlined it and we can check again.

    How about this for $527 before shipping. I don't think I've forgotten anything.
    Case: ANTEC Solution Series Super Mid Tower Case with 350W Power Supply
    CPU: AMD Athlon 64 3000+, 512KB L2 Cache 64-bit Processor - Retail
    Mobo: EPOX "EP-8KDA3I" NVIDIA nForce3 250 Chipset for AMD Socket 754
    RAM: Corsair Value Select 184 Pin 512MB DDR PC-3200 - Retail
    Video: Matrox G400 DualHead AGP 2x w/2 Sony Multiscan 15sf CRT's
    Modem: Encore 56K V.92 Internal PCI Fax Modem (NetoDragon)
    LAN/Sound built in, using existing FDD/kbd/mouse/case fan
    HD #1: SATA Master, Maxtor 160GB 7200RPM SATA
    HD #2: IDE#1 Master, Maxtor 40GB 5400RPM ATA-100
    DVD#1: IDE#2 Master, NEC 16X Double Layer DVD±RW Drive
    DVD#2: IDE#2 Slave, MSI Black 16X DVD-ROM

    ... and I will probably add another 160GB SATA later for RAID. Seems like a lot of power. After I copy my data I can remove the 40GB and that should help on power, as well as put the DVDs on the primary channel.

    Thanks again.
  • ThraxThrax 🐌 Austin, TX Icrontian
    edited December 2004
    Socket 754 is about to all but disappear for the Athlon 64; the 3700+ was supposedly the last s754 Athlon 64 -- the rest of the 754 offerings in 2005 will be Palermo-cored Semprons. I would, at all costs, try to avoid it.

    The NEC ND3500-A is the best DVD burner there is; stability, speed, versatility.
  • JimboraeJimborae Newbury, Berks, UK New
    edited December 2004
    The reason I chose a S754 system was:

    A. Cost would appear to be paramount & which ever way you slice it S754 is cheaper (by about $60 in this case)
    B. The machine won't be overclocked and at stock speeds S754 isn't any noticeably slower. For the tasks it's wanted for, this machine will be alot more than adequate.
    C. AlohaSurfer said it has to last a long time. Therefore when he's due to upgrade next, in about 5-7 years judging by how long the last machine has been used, he'll probably have to buy a whole new system anyway.

    I agree with what you say about S754 Thrax, but in these unique circumstances I think it fits the bill perfectly. If Alhoa can afford to use S939 then he should but I got the impression that money was very tight.

    With regards to the PSU, its an Antec 350w, these are quality power supplys and I've used them to power more demanding systems than the one I specified above. Most people here will tell you that Antec are one of the best makers of quality, reliable psu's so I wouldn't worry about it, especially as you are not overclocking.
  • AlohaSurferAlohaSurfer A little rock called O'ahu
    edited December 2004
    Your analysis is correct for what I wrote. But since then, I've read a lot and discovered Nforce4 is about to release. In light of this, I'll save two more weeks and at the same time the top-of-the-line Nforce3 250 board and CPU have come down. What's two more weeks for a couple years on the back end? =)

    CPU: AMD Athlon 64 (Winchester 512K L2 939 pin) 3200+ CPU Retail
    Mb: Epox "EP-9NDA3J" Socket 939 nforce3 A64/ 64FX mobo
    RAM: 2 GB (2x 1GB 184-pit Dual Channel PC-3200 DDR 400)
    Case: Custom Aluminum Alloy full tower (getting locally)
    P/S: Antec Silent TruePower 420-450W ATX (SATA leads!)
    Video: Matrox Millenium G400 Dualhead 32MB AGP 2x
    Modem: USR 56K V.92 Internal PCI Performance Pro Fax Modem(No Voice), (the extra 50 bucks pays off in time saved, my first sportster was $700. rock solid)
    Drives:
    2x Maxtor 160GB 7200 rpm SATA HDs, striped with RAID (just got them locally fire-sale)
    NEC ND3500-A 16x Dual Layer DVD+-RW (Primary IDE master)
    Sony CRW-230ED 52x32x52 CD-RW (Primary IDE Slave- cant pass up a Sony burner for $26, my first one was $1400)
    2x Maxtor 40GB 5400 ATA-100 drives (Secondary IDE master just got! & slave is the old one - deep storage)
    Misc: 2 new 80mm fans (exhaust), LAN/sound onboard, existing peripherals.

    $1010 at curent prices. Now THAT's a system I can live with for a long time! Its a lot like my old Dual-P166 Tyan system - got capabilites I'll never ever use (eg, Pure64), but the stuff I DO use works great. And by the time I'm ready to buy in a month, can wait a couple weeks after that. Nforce4 will drive down the prices hopefully!
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