Upcoming A64 Rig

KingFish

Now that I have the cash scraped together I'm looking to put together my first A64 rig. I've looked at the A64 cores and have decided on the 3500+ 130nm core, socket 939. I have doubts about quality control and quality issues with the 90nm Winchester cores so I decided to go with what is rock solid. The prices on newegg are favorable for the 3500+ for me and I doubt that anything clocked higher than that is worth the money beyond that point.

I looked at the chipsets and would like to go with the nf3 ultra chipset but can't find a decent motherboard on newegg that's in stock with that chipset right now. I read up on the k8t800 pro chipset and it appears to get the nods in the reviews so it looks like that would be a good choice at this point. At this point it looks like I'm strongly leaning towards the asus a8v deluxe. Any good reasons not to go with that board in favor of the MSI or Abit boards being offered with that chipset? If so, what would you recommend and why? I'm highly interested in bang for the buck and am a bit price senstitive but it all depends on the offerings for the money. It looks to me like Abit is a bit behind the power curve on this offering.

I currently have an Nvidia 6800GT that I really like and have no interest in pci-e or SLI. That card will be used in the new machine I build.

My biggest question is in regards to memory. I see several offerings, many from the same manufacturer, in which I don't see many differences except for minor latency and support voltage tolerances. I looked at the selections on newegg (DDR400, 2X512MB) and came across these:

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-900&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-379&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-220-006&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-145-450&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-310&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-310&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-883&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-145-449&depa=1

There are many other selections in this category too but I won't list them all. Do any of these appear to be good choices or would anyone recommend something different. I also noted that there are several choices by Geil (which I perceive as a low quality memory manufacturer) that are even more expensive than these above. I also noticed two brands that I don't even recognize (patriot memory and pqi). What's the deal with those two and are they even worth considering?

I plan on gaming with the machine (joint operations and half life 2 mainly) and may attempt a mild overclock with the machine although stability takes much more precedence. I'm wanting with getting the most for the money. The machine it is replacing is an amd 2800+ at stock settings with a gig of value ram.

Thanks for the help guys/gals.

KingFish

muddocktor

KingFish wrote:

Now that I have the cash scraped together I'm looking to put together my first A64 rig. I've looked at the A64 cores and have decided on the 3500+ 130nm core, socket 939. I have doubts about quality control and quality issues with the 90nm Winchester cores so I decided to go with what is rock solid. The prices on newegg are favorable for the 3500+ for me and I doubt that anything clocked higher than that is worth the money beyond that point.

I looked at the chipsets and would like to go with the nf3 ultra chipset but can't find a decent motherboard on newegg that's in stock with that chipset right now. I read up on the k8t800 pro chipset and it appears to get the nods in the reviews so it looks like that would be a good choice at this point. At this point it looks like I'm strongly leaning towards the asus a8v deluxe. Any good reasons not to go with that board in favor of the MSI or Abit boards being offered with that chipset? If so, what would you recommend and why? I'm highly interested in bang for the buck and am a bit price senstitive but it all depends on the offerings for the money. It looks to me like Abit is a bit behind the power curve on this offering.

I currently have an Nvidia 6800GT that I really like and have no interest in pci-e or SLI. That card will be used in the new machine I build.

My biggest question is in regards to memory. I see several offerings, many from the same manufacturer, in which I don't see many differences except for minor latency and support voltage tolerances. I looked at the selections on newegg (DDR400, 2X512MB) and came across these:

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-900&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-379&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-220-006&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-145-450&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-310&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-310&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-146-883&depa=1

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-145-449&depa=1

There are many other selections in this category too but I won't list them all. Do any of these appear to be good choices or would anyone recommend something different. I also noted that there are several choices by Geil (which I perceive as a low quality memory manufacturer) that are even more expensive than these above. I also noticed two brands that I don't even recognize (patriot memory and pqi). What's the deal with those two and are they even worth considering?

I plan on gaming with the machine (joint operations and half life 2 mainly) and may attempt a mild overclock with the machine although stability takes much more precedence. I'm wanting with getting the most for the money. The machine it is replacing is an amd 2800+ at stock settings with a gig of value ram.

Thanks for the help guys/gals.

KingFish

For your memory, get ddr that is using the TCCD chips, which will run with decent timings even at high fsb speeds and will run 2-2-2-5 timings out to 220-230 or so. The Patriot and PQI ram you are alluding to use the TCCD chips and are supposed to be good. Missileman has a thread going about the patriot ram in the Overclocking forum, if you're interested. I'm sure the Geil ram you are talking about is using TCCD chips also. Anandtech has several articles on fast ddr that are informative.

Mwave.com has the EPoX 9NDA3J and 9NDA3+ nf3 ultra boards in stock for $93.50 and $121.00 respectively and they are a reliable vendor too. I have the 9NDA3+ and so far it's been a pretty nice mobo and easy enough to set up and it overclocks pretty well too. I'm not a big fan of most of Via's chipsets and I try to stay away from them when there is a viable alternative myself.

KingFish

Thanks muddock
I doubt if I'll get an epox board. I've had boards with via chipsets and have had problems here and there. I've never had a bit of trouble whatsoever with any nvidia chipsets I've owned. I did check out anandtech's ram article and found it to be quite informative. It looks like OCZ Platinum Rev 2 is the top dog for socket 939 PC3200 with the Crucial Ballistix making a good showing. Thanks for the pointers sir.

KF

muddocktor

I'm not sure that you understood about the EPoX board, they are nforce3 Ultra chipset boards and the 9NDA3+ like I got is quite a bargain with all the extras that came with it. The only question mark is long term reliability of them and at least EPoX has changed to better quality caps on their boards and they give a 2 year warrantee now too.

KingFish

My apologies for the misunderstanding muddock. I know the epox is an nf3 ultra chipset based motherboard. The two sentences are completely different thoughts and I may have jumped a little too quickly. I was making a blanket statement about my experiences with via chipsets versus the nvidia ones. I had moved on from the epox statement but after rereading it I can see where it is easily inferred I was still talking about the epox board.

There is a ton of information to sift through on ram memory and socket 939. When I come up with something I'll run it by you and see what you think if you don't mind sir. Thanks!

muddocktor

Yeah, it was a whole new platform for me to learn 2 months ago too, but it's not that much different from what we are used to. As far as the Winchester procs go, the only problem I've seen with mine is the Prime 95 instability deal that other people have noted. Mine is a retail proc though, so I will RMA that sucker to AMD in a few months when the new stepping procs come out.

Personally, I'm not so sure that the Prime 95 deal is a big thing; the damn proc is folding stable at over 2500 MHz, both Gromacs and Tinker core work.

KingFish

I have pretty good heat dissipation with 7 fans and a thermaltake hsf in the case (yes it's quite loud) and a good enermax 465 watt psu so I can handle the higher heat and wattage requirements that the newcastle core requires. I'll be buying OEM from newegg. I really don't want to have to go through the hassle of RMA if it can be avoided.

KingFish

OK, here's what I have pretty much decided on for the components of the A64 rig. Here's a listing of what I selected on newegg:

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=19-103-463&catalog=23&manufactory=BROWSE

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=13-131-510&catalog=23&manufactory=BROWSE

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=20-220-033&catalog=23&manufactory=BROWSE

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=35-106-038&catalog=23&manufactory=BROWSE

I changed the OEM chip to a boxed one in light of the recent news stories of the fake AMD chips. I think I have found the lowest priced samsung tccd chips on newegg. If someone finds any cheaper, can you pass me the product info on newegg? Think these components will work together or does anyone have suggestions for substitutions? I'm pretty much deadset on getting it from newegg as I've had quite good experiences with them in the past. I'm nearly 100% that I want that processor. The components will be paired with an Nvidia 6800GT AGP videocard. I'll also be purchasing a Western Digital SATA hard drive with the above. Thanks all for the input. If everything goes as planned I'll order the parts monday or tuesday.

KingFish

muddocktor

Your proc choice should be just fine; Newcastle is a proven design. The Patriot ram is also a great choice, from what I've read in testing on the web and also Missileman's experience with it here at the forums. For your motherboard choice, I can't tell you anything about that one because personally, anything that uses a via chipset I try to avoid if there's a viable Nvidia alternative. Newegg also has the EPoX EP-9NDA3+ mobo in stock for $126.00, which is basically the same price range as that Asus board and mine was easy to set up and also to overclock. It also comes very well equipped, it has a fancy screwdriver in the box, round cables and also heatsinks for you to mount on the pwm mosfets, which probably would help a lot when dealing with the increased current requirements of Newcastle over a Winchester. To each his own though. Finally, I have no experience with that TT hsf but I do know it's one of their older K8 designs and the TT hsf's I've had in the past didn't impress me very much. If I was going to buy an aftermarket hsf for my machine, I would spend a little more money and get a Thermalright XP90 or XP120, but I wouldn't pay Newegg's ridiculously high prices for them. SVC has the XP120 in stock for $49.95 and I've bought several heatsinks from them with no problems.

KingFish

Cool deal doc, just the info I needed. I'm hard pressed to even spend that much on an aftermarket hsf, I definitely can't see spending 50 bucks on a heatsink. You may have convinced me to go with the epox. I have cold feet about it because I have no experience with epox and am hesitant because I don't know as much about them as I do asus. I think I have a solid setup for OC'ing if I want although I doubt I'll spend the time doing that. I need all the help I can get keeping ahead of some of them aussies that are folding like mad.

Thanks for the help mudd.

muddocktor

Epox used to have a bad capacitor problem even after Abit and Asus had swapped to using Japanese or Taiwanese caps but EPoX has also switched to better quality caps on their mobos now. Plus, they are giving a 2 year warrantee on their boards now, just like Abit. I had 1 Epox board before and it ran great all the way up until the bad cap problem killed it (almost 2 years and their warrantee was only 1 year then). I decided to give them another shot since the board looked pretty decent and had a great set of features. So far I'm real impressed with it. Another hsf you might look into for your rig is the big Zalman hsf's that Tex is so high on. I've never messed with them but I've read from more than 1 person online saying that they work real good. If you decide to go with a Zalman though, be sure to check their website for compatibility as it's a big round mofo and might give problems on some boards. Even if you don't overclock the board much you will still see some good performance out of it, keep the proc nice and cool.

profdlp

I am loving the system I just built.

Jimborae

Personally I'd say that Asus board is a very good choice, I had no problems or issues with the K8V Deluxe which was basically the s754 version. I also heard very good reports about the A8V Deluxe regarding quality & stability. Imo if thats what you're comfatable with then go for it.

KingFish

Damn prof, GMTA! I ordered my parts from newegg with the patriot ram and newcastle core just like you. I hadn't even read that thread you linked until just now. I'm dripping with anticipation to build mine, I can't wait. I decided to go with the asus board with the kt800 pro chipset. Will post more when it's built. Thanks for the confirmation Jimborae, I read elsewhere too that it was a solid board.

KF

KingFish

Well I have all the parts thrown together now and a fresh operating system installed. After a few SATA issues it's humming along pretty good. It's damn snappy compared to the 2800+ it's replacing. The thermaltake sounds like it could fly away at any moment. I can't wait to get it inside a case and the rheostat working to slow down the rpm's a bit.