Power Supply "Rails" & amps?
I've looked online, and have tried to understand how a power supply is utilized in my system. I understand that there is amperage ratings for 3.3v, 5v, and 12v rails, but not quite sure how this applies to certain components. Specifically, when I have my Radeon 9800 Pro AGP installed, it is drawing from the 3.3 amps right? But then when I plug in the additional 4-pin power, that would then be drawing from a 12v rail? How do I know how many amps, and from which 12v rail?
The bottom line, I am looking for a new PS for my system, and trying to figure out what the heck I need. I have a dated system (XP 2100+, 512 meg, 120 gig 7200, DVD+RW, a few usb2 addon devices, 3 fans, 300watt no-name PS) and a friend just gave me his Radeon 9800 pro. But when I run it with certain games (HL2), I get artifacting - but he never got that on his system. I have actually had to underclock the card a bit to get past this. I am told that my power supply could easily be the reason for this, but as I started looking into them, understanding what I need is just not clicking for me! I have had the recommendation of going with an FSP AX-400 or 450, and I'm guessing either will work fine - but I would really like to understand what I'm doing here.
If someone could direct me to a good source I would be most grateful. Thanks
The bottom line, I am looking for a new PS for my system, and trying to figure out what the heck I need. I have a dated system (XP 2100+, 512 meg, 120 gig 7200, DVD+RW, a few usb2 addon devices, 3 fans, 300watt no-name PS) and a friend just gave me his Radeon 9800 pro. But when I run it with certain games (HL2), I get artifacting - but he never got that on his system. I have actually had to underclock the card a bit to get past this. I am told that my power supply could easily be the reason for this, but as I started looking into them, understanding what I need is just not clicking for me! I have had the recommendation of going with an FSP AX-400 or 450, and I'm guessing either will work fine - but I would really like to understand what I'm doing here.
If someone could direct me to a good source I would be most grateful. Thanks
0
Comments
But I don't know enough to rule it out - I really hope a new supply helps out, but if it turns out to be overheating, then I will really have to scratch my head!! ;-)
bikerboy
Just playing with the calculator with your specs you're pushing 300 Watts, which is probably your problem.
You know that tool is awesome but it is in need of a major overhaul.
Well, before work this morning, I got the side cover off, popped open a window (34 degrees where I am) and channeled a megaflow of cool air into the case with a large floor fan, after the machine sat off all night. I ran Half Life 2 as fast as possible after boot, but still get the same pixelation at default clocking! I shut the thing down again, and pulled the card. It didn't seem too hot, but what am I comparing it to? One thing I DO see is what appears to be a mega ton of dark "dust" all around the outside of the cooler, on the card itself. I pulled out my air can, but it does NOTHING to this stuff. It's baked on whatever it is. Maybe this is an issue?? How does one clean something like this?? This has to be from friend's computer because the rest of mine looks pretty clean.
I will check out that wattage calculator - being dated may be appropriate for this machine.
As a side note, my wife came in during the 6am test throwing out phrases like "mad scientist" and "midlife crisis". Ha ha ha ha, Wives...
No, it didn't look burned - just really packed on layers of dust. As if maybe the cooling fan is blowing air onto the card, and the card has never been cleaned. Ever.
I just went through the wattage calculator, and it comes up with 298 watts *without* the second hard drive - which makes sense, since I couldn't boot the system with the 2nd drive attached.
I should also add that I was directed to a pretty good source that helps answer some of my initial questions about the understanding of Rails & amperages - for anyone that's interested, the link is:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article28-page1.html
I just did a search on "circuit board cleaning" just before getting your message, and found a can of specialty cleaner selling for like $100 ???!?!?? I didn't save the link but wow!! I like your application a lot better!!
If that card was never cleaned, you may be seeing the artifacting due to heat buildup. It's possible that cleaning it will cause it to stop artifacting if it stops overheating.
$100 cleaner - that's just insane! It's probably just alcohol anyway.
So, with the alcohol - I just take a cuetip (however thats spelled) dip it in the alcohol, and scrub (lightly and carefully) away? What do I wipe it off with, and how long does it need to sit after I'm done?
With the exception of anti-static precaution, anything else I should know? I'm going to stop and get the alcohol on the way home from work, hopefully something Home Depot carries...
Tx
If you manage to find the 99% alcohol, you do it exactly as you described - though you may need to use both ends of several cotton swabs to get all the caked on dust away... then you just let it dry. The 99% pure stuff dries quite quickly, you can watch it vaporize.
If you have canned air and you blow out the heatsink, make sure you hold the fan steady with a cotton swab or toothpick while you do so. The air can cause the fan to spin faster than it's meant to and has a slight possibility of causing damage to the fan motor. It seems like you've got all your bases covered here.
If you can't locate the alcohol at Home Depot, you may want to check either a drug store or a hypermarket. I've seen it at both places. It usually costs about twice what the 70% pure stuff costs, but it works better because the 70% pure stuff leaves water on the electronics after all the alcohol evaporates - not a good thing!
Good luck!
1. power rating on the 3.3V and 5V lines combined. I want over 200W, prefer 220W or more. You don't just add the two together. Most PSUs will give a seperate rating for the max combined draw.
2. weight. the heavier the better. I want a transformer with lots of steel for less saturation and smoother out put. It will also provide a little bit of voltage sag protection. More weight also often means biger heat sinks on the rectifiers. This is always good.
3. Big fans. At least dual 80mm if not 120mm. Cooling is your friend.
I don't really care about the total rating. I have seen a "500W" PSU next to a "350W". The 350 had better rating onf the 3.3+5 and was heavier. Teh 350 was under rated and the 500 was exagerated. I took the good 350.
You don't have to spend a fortune. there are better ones out there, but this isn't bad for $42 to your door. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817171007
I found 91% alcohol (the best I could find where I went), pulled the card, and went to work on it. In order to do the best job possible, I decided to remove the heatsink - and found something rather interesting. As soon as I started removing the screws, it was apparent that the heatsink was a bit loose feeling. Normally, I would expect to have to "pull" it from the processor even after having removed the screws due to the thermal compound. But there was no such attachment. It almost looks like whoever put this thing on decided that the residue from the previous heatsink was enough to do the job! Well, with a combination of fingernail and alcohol I completely cleaned both surfaces (gpu and heatsink), then got some arctic silver and applied it accordingly (thin layer per info I found elsewhere on this site). Between that and cleaning off the hardcore dust around memory chips, etc., I was met with a HUGE surprise. Not only did I NOT have to UNDERCLOCK it by -18 gpu and -20 memory, but with ATI Tray Tools, I was able to OVERCLOCK it by nearly the same margin! That is a pretty major difference all things considered! I ran Half Life 2 and Doom 3 in overclocked mode, and NO artifacting whatsoever. But, given that this card has clearly been through a lot, I've decided to just run it at default settings. Still far better than before.
I contacted my friend to ask him what he knew about this, and the truth came out - when he pulled it, he removed his *really good" heatsink, and replaced it with this Zalman - and apparently payed little-to-no attention to the fact that he failed to incorporate thermal compound (and failed to clean the residue from the previous). That explains why it ran so great in his machine, but not mine. This would have been good information at the outset, since he led me to believe this card had been using the same heatsink when he was using it - so I ruled this kind of problem out. Goes to show ya!
So, there it is. The first response to my initial question was right on the money after all. I still need a new power supply, so I can get my second hard drive back in, and then things should really be looking good.
Thanks for the thoughts on what to look for in a supply too, I will put it to good use... and thanks everyone else for helping me get this figured out & getting the card back to normal without frying it!!