Do Mini-DV tapes deteriorate with use?

Tim

In the process of filming and editing my weekly webshow, I've recently noticed an occasional skip in the playback on the computer. It looks fine on the camera during playback from the Mini-DV tape itself, but once on the computer it gets a small skip now and then. It didn't do this before last week. Why could it be happening now? Recording over the same area of the tape too many times? I try to spread it out some.

RWB

I don't know much about camcorders period, but tape is generally magnetic. I was contemplating this just the other day when I was inquiring on what DV Cam I should get. (Wow I used TWO big words haha)

Anyways, just like a video tape, it should deteriorate after being written to more than once, becuase it is storing information in analog, not digital. Therefore, the magnetic material is being shifted around. It would degrade more and more....

I COULD be wrong, but I doubt it.

Enverex

They are possibly also suseptible to dust and other bits getting in them, which could be what it interfering, I would see if there are any other obvious bits in it that could be causing it...

NS

CB

Thesew guys are right. Here at the TV station, we mark our MiniDVs and DVCpro tapes each time we use them. We tos the MiniDVs after about ten uses. But, we hang on to the DVCpro tapes for almost thirty uses. (they're only a little bit more durable, but they're A LOT more expencive, so we deal with it.)

Normaly, the first thing to go on the miniDV tapes is the control track (this is where the camera or deck will write the time code). The control track gets the most wear, being rewritten so often, with such dence information.

If the control track isn't writing properly, then it may cause your deck to play the tape in an erratic fashion. However, the camera should still play the tape fine, because it does not rely on control track to regulate the speed of the tape, like an editing deck will. This will espesialy cause problems when capturing digitaly from the tape.

So, yea... It could be time to pitch that tape...

You might also want to clean the heads in your decks.

seversphere

If the playback is okay on the camera lcd then something during capturing, processing, or playback of the raw data is making the skip. When there is a problem with the tape then it will show up when playing back on the camera.

One tip for miniDV cameras is to use the same type and brand of tape with the camera so you don't have all kinds of different materials left of the head. Of course cleaning the head is good. Another important tip is do not leave the tape inside the camera. When done take it out and put it in it's container. Most of my problems with miniDV are at the beginning of the tape where it gets rerecorded the most or where I have left it sitting overnight or days til the next time I use it.

bothered

RWB had this to say
becuase it is storing information in analog, not digital.

I'm not sure which it is, There is only two states for the magnetic particles to be, north or south, depending on the polarity of the signal on the recording head coil, so could you call that digital?
Tape will deteriorate even if it's never used due to the Earths magnetic field and any other stray magnetic fields as well as temperature and humidity changes. Having said that I've some audio tapes that don't sound too bad, to my ancient ears, that are over 20 years old! At least when I play them in the car they don't.

bothered.

hypermood

Tim, Mini-DV tapes do seem to wear out on me after about 20 uses. At this point there will be dropouts in the playback from the camcorder. If you see perfect playback on the camcorder but you see skips after you transfer to the PC, then you are dropping frames in the transfer process.

The transfer process is a real time stream capture. If the PC cannot keep up with the stream you will see skips in the captured playback. Some capture software will inform you if you drop frames. Even if you have a super fast PC you can interrupt the stream easily by launching an application, web browsing, etc.

RWB, the Mini-DV is a digital encoding format not analog. There are similarities between DAT and Mini-DV.

Here is a link to a quick FAQ on DV

http://www.zenera.com/reference/dvtape.html

WuGgaRoO

it could be drivers or an old program that isnt supposed to be used with winxp...

Tim

Okay, I may buy a new tape cassette to use. The one I have now has been in the camera for about 10 months straight. I've only taken it out 2-3 times, because I have to remove the tripod mounting pad to do it. I have a Canon ZR45MC, which has always worked well for me.

I have quite a few VHS tapes that are up to 17 years old, and as long as they were recorded on high speed (the 2 hour per cassette) setting, they still look good. Tapes recorded on the low speed 6 hour setting start to get fuzzy and have static after only 2-4 years maximum.

When transferring the Mini-DV tape to my computer, I use a FireWire cable and card. I usually make sure the computer is not connected to the internet when I'm doing my DV work, but these last 2 weeks it may have been connected while I was uploading the new show for editing. I don't exactly remember.

Watch episode #38 of my show to see an example of the skip that takes place. It happens right around the 20 second mark. I had said "Fall, spring, summer, whatever it may be.", but it got messed up. My high rate edited file and the high bit rate source file also had the skips, but the camera's playback on the tape was fine. It comes out sounding like "Fall spri sumr, whater may be". I could reload and re-edit it if I weren't so lazy.

I've always been concerned that something like this might happen. Now I know.

Dexter

I would suggest checking a known skip spot on the tape again. If it does not have the skip, then re-digitize it into the computer again. Then see if the skip exists at the same spot when you play it on the computer. If the skip shows up in the exact same spot, you know that it is the tape. If the skip does not show up this time, then you know it had something to do with the capture from the tape.

Yes, DV tapes, like all tapes, are subject to dropouts, magnetic interference, and general wear and tear, like others here have siad. But if you never see the skips on tape, but you do on playback in the computer, I am inclined to think your capture process is introducing them. How do you capture your DV, and do you optimize other computer processes while capturing to give the capture process priority?

Dexter...

Tim

I don't let the computer do anything else while capturing or compiling video data. This wussy little Celeron 1.1 and 384 MB of PC100 can barely handle that much work.

And I don't have the computer connected to the internet during the video work either. That may have been a problem in a couple recent episodes.