I know macs arent that great but im looking for one. Doesnt need to be the newest one g3 or g4 some like that. Cheaper would be great just want one to learn on. Anyone know where I could get one or a good website to look?
Depends on what OS you want to learn. I would assume OS X because that's what is modern. I wouldn't bother learning OS 9 since it's pretty much dead, and 9 and X are so different as to make learning 9 pointless.
If you want to learn 10, you'll need at the very least a high-end G3 or a low-end G4. EBay is probably your best bet.
If you live in a larger city, you most likely will have a Mac store that deals with used gear. Check them out first before you buy anything off eBay.
I agree with Prime about learning OS X. OS X is very different from the 9 or lower OS's. If your intention is to be functional on Macs going forward for future employment considerations, most likely you will be using X or higher. However, if you are wanting to learn on one because you want to be able to tech support people on Macs, then you should learn on an older Mac OS as well. Anything from 7 to 9 will be quite similar, though I would reccommend learning at least 8.1 or higher as that is probably the cutoff you will find most Macs at. There are several good Mac Forums on the net as well if you run into questions that can't be solved by the few of us here who know Macs. http://www.macusersforum.com/ is one of the better ones.
MACS are the choice of designers and mulimedia professionals. Why? Dunno. A PC, that can be cheaper, will outperform a MAC in speed. Ask a MAC person why they like it...and you'll probably get the answer "I like the interface".
MAC users usually look at those funny 3-button mice and wonder why when their mouse just has one. It's just a preference thing. Of course you have to learn all those keyboard shortcuts MACS are famous for plus have an extra hand to do so. Lessee...open Word is COMMAND, CTL, PERIOD, SHIFT, L. (Only MAC users will get that joke)
MACS are the choice of designers and mulimedia professionals. Why? Dunno. A PC, that can be cheaper, will outperform a MAC in speed. Ask a MAC person why they like it...and you'll probably get the answer "I like the interface".
MAC users usually look at those funny 3-button mice and wonder why when their mouse just has one. It's just a preference thing. Of course you have to learn all those keyboard shortcuts MACS are famous for plus have an extra hand to do so. Lessee...open Word is COMMAND, CTL, PERIOD, SHIFT, L. (Only MAC users will get that joke)
Pretty much on the nail MM. Although, the MAC fanboys in my class say that the MAC is 5 years more advanced than any PC... they are so full of ****
Actually, MacOS Classic (OS8 - OS9) are still very much in use, since all the Mac's I've ever seen with the exception of two ran Classic, the principle reason being because it's easy. It's easy to maintain Classic, since it's "registry" (preferences folder) is clearly labeled and uninstalling an application is as simple as deleting its preferences file and application folder. It's easy to use Classic, since they've been refining it for two decades now (not to mention all Mac games use Classic with the exception of Warcraft III). It's easy to get development software for, since the Mac Programming Workshop (MPW) is a free download from Apple's website and will build anything written in C, C++, Pascal, and anything else you add a "tool" for (read: plug-in).
OS X is essentially BSD with a pretty interface. Doing anything to the system besides using software requires Linux shell experience (command line), since it's system management capabilities are on-par with those of Linux (no GUI for anything besides customizing your interface and configuring your network). I seem to remember there being an x86 tree for Darwin, and you can get the Darwin source off the Apple website. Almost all the good OS X software is a Linux port, and you don't need a Mac to learn Linux.
That's my impression anyway. Your Mileage May Vary.
MAC fanboys in my class say that the MAC is 5 years more advanced than any PC... they are so full of ****
It's a half-truth. The processor isn't comparable (PowerPC is a RISC architecture, comparisions with CISC are fairly meaningless). Everything else in the system, definitely no. The G5 has a HyperTransport bus, uses PC2700 DDR SDRAM (CAS3 is stock btw), uses AGP Pro graphics cards (choose between Radeon 9800 Pro or GeForce FX 5200 Ultra), has a DVD+/-RW drive from Pioneer (available on NewEgg for a fraction of what Apple wants for it), has Serial ATA hard drives, all pretty much current technology.
On the flip side, the G5 is in the same boat as the A64: very little commercial 64-bit software.
Speed in real world applications is roughly equal between high-end Mac's and high-end PC's. iMac's aren't that great of a value, since a similarly-performing PC can be had for much less.
I know macs arent that great but im looking for one. Doesnt need to be the newest one g3 or g4 some like that. Cheaper would be great just want one to learn on. Anyone know where I could get one or a good website to look?
Lessee...
*Sigh*. Here's the problem: cheap Mac's don't do OSX very well. 450MHz PowerPC 750 or 7550 minimum for halfway decent performance. Jaguar and Panther (10.2 and 10.3 respectively) use 2D/3D accellerated interfaces, so having a decent graphics card is a real plus for making a usable system. The problem is, all G3's and some G4's use PCI graphics only, no AGP, so your ONLY choice is the Radeon 7000, which is discontinued. Most PCI Mac-users get by by flashing certain PC Radeon 7000's with Mac firmware, but even those are discontinued now though the supply is still ample right now.
AGP-capable G4's aren't cheap, and neither are Mac AGP cards. Fortunately you can flash most GeForce 3-4 cards with Mac firmware.
Your ONLY option for multi-channel Mac sound is the M-Audio Revolution 7.1, which isn't cheap. The stock sound is acceptable for making beeping noises, but I wouldn't want to listen to music on it much less watch a movie. Oh and on anything newer than a G4-Sawtooth, there isn't a Mic or Line-In jack.
Mac's like fast RAM as much as PC's do, so the first thing you can do when you get your Mac is throw away what RAM came with it and buy yourself some Corsair. Note that all that the beige G3 uses low-density PC66, Blue&White G3 - Sawtooth G4 use low-density PC100, and the rest use PC2100 DDR. Pretty sure it's unbufferred modules only.
Mac's understand the HID protocol, so any USB mouse will work. Only OHCI (no UHCI) USB controllers will work, though they're easy to find. Stock Apple driver will work with these and most 1394 cards.
Anything older than a Blue&White G3 will have narrow SCSI in it, as well as maybe an IDE controller (pre-Ultra ATA, usually one device only). Beige G3's and 2nd revision Blue&White G3's and up support two devices per IDE chain. Adding a SIIG or Acard UltraATA controller will speed things up, though the Promise controllers seem to have as many problems with Macs as they do with PC's.
Any Mac that won't boot up probably has a dead CMOS battery, so that's an easy way to get a cheap Mac.
Whatever you do, do NOT invest in a Power Macintosh or Performa 62xx. I'd stay away from 5500/6500/Twentieth Anniversery Macintosh also, since they have a firmware bug. Anything prior to a Blue&White G3 is not officially supported under OS X, though most Mac's with G3 or G4 CPU daughtercards will work with a couple of hacks (my Umax S900 clone for example).
Comments
If you want to learn 10, you'll need at the very least a high-end G3 or a low-end G4. EBay is probably your best bet.
I agree with Prime about learning OS X. OS X is very different from the 9 or lower OS's. If your intention is to be functional on Macs going forward for future employment considerations, most likely you will be using X or higher. However, if you are wanting to learn on one because you want to be able to tech support people on Macs, then you should learn on an older Mac OS as well. Anything from 7 to 9 will be quite similar, though I would reccommend learning at least 8.1 or higher as that is probably the cutoff you will find most Macs at. There are several good Mac Forums on the net as well if you run into questions that can't be solved by the few of us here who know Macs. http://www.macusersforum.com/ is one of the better ones.
Dexter...
MAC users usually look at those funny 3-button mice and wonder why when their mouse just has one. It's just a preference thing. Of course you have to learn all those keyboard shortcuts MACS are famous for plus have an extra hand to do so. Lessee...open Word is COMMAND, CTL, PERIOD, SHIFT, L. (Only MAC users will get that joke)
Pretty much on the nail MM. Although, the MAC fanboys in my class say that the MAC is 5 years more advanced than any PC... they are so full of ****
OS X is essentially BSD with a pretty interface. Doing anything to the system besides using software requires Linux shell experience (command line), since it's system management capabilities are on-par with those of Linux (no GUI for anything besides customizing your interface and configuring your network). I seem to remember there being an x86 tree for Darwin, and you can get the Darwin source off the Apple website. Almost all the good OS X software is a Linux port, and you don't need a Mac to learn Linux.
That's my impression anyway. Your Mileage May Vary.
-drasnor
It's a half-truth. The processor isn't comparable (PowerPC is a RISC architecture, comparisions with CISC are fairly meaningless). Everything else in the system, definitely no. The G5 has a HyperTransport bus, uses PC2700 DDR SDRAM (CAS3 is stock btw), uses AGP Pro graphics cards (choose between Radeon 9800 Pro or GeForce FX 5200 Ultra), has a DVD+/-RW drive from Pioneer (available on NewEgg for a fraction of what Apple wants for it), has Serial ATA hard drives, all pretty much current technology.
On the flip side, the G5 is in the same boat as the A64: very little commercial 64-bit software.
Speed in real world applications is roughly equal between high-end Mac's and high-end PC's. iMac's aren't that great of a value, since a similarly-performing PC can be had for much less.
-drasnor
Lessee...
*Sigh*. Here's the problem: cheap Mac's don't do OSX very well. 450MHz PowerPC 750 or 7550 minimum for halfway decent performance. Jaguar and Panther (10.2 and 10.3 respectively) use 2D/3D accellerated interfaces, so having a decent graphics card is a real plus for making a usable system. The problem is, all G3's and some G4's use PCI graphics only, no AGP, so your ONLY choice is the Radeon 7000, which is discontinued. Most PCI Mac-users get by by flashing certain PC Radeon 7000's with Mac firmware, but even those are discontinued now though the supply is still ample right now.
AGP-capable G4's aren't cheap, and neither are Mac AGP cards. Fortunately you can flash most GeForce 3-4 cards with Mac firmware.
Your ONLY option for multi-channel Mac sound is the M-Audio Revolution 7.1, which isn't cheap. The stock sound is acceptable for making beeping noises, but I wouldn't want to listen to music on it much less watch a movie. Oh and on anything newer than a G4-Sawtooth, there isn't a Mic or Line-In jack.
Mac's like fast RAM as much as PC's do, so the first thing you can do when you get your Mac is throw away what RAM came with it and buy yourself some Corsair. Note that all that the beige G3 uses low-density PC66, Blue&White G3 - Sawtooth G4 use low-density PC100, and the rest use PC2100 DDR. Pretty sure it's unbufferred modules only.
Mac's understand the HID protocol, so any USB mouse will work. Only OHCI (no UHCI) USB controllers will work, though they're easy to find. Stock Apple driver will work with these and most 1394 cards.
Anything older than a Blue&White G3 will have narrow SCSI in it, as well as maybe an IDE controller (pre-Ultra ATA, usually one device only). Beige G3's and 2nd revision Blue&White G3's and up support two devices per IDE chain. Adding a SIIG or Acard UltraATA controller will speed things up, though the Promise controllers seem to have as many problems with Macs as they do with PC's.
Any Mac that won't boot up probably has a dead CMOS battery, so that's an easy way to get a cheap Mac.
Whatever you do, do NOT invest in a Power Macintosh or Performa 62xx. I'd stay away from 5500/6500/Twentieth Anniversery Macintosh also, since they have a firmware bug. Anything prior to a Blue&White G3 is not officially supported under OS X, though most Mac's with G3 or G4 CPU daughtercards will work with a couple of hacks (my Umax S900 clone for example).
I shop for Mac at:
Other World Computing: http://www.macsales.com
Mac Gurus: http://www.macgurus.com
eBay: http://www.ebay.com
-drasnor