For the record, I saw the Smashing Pumpkins live back in 96 and it was the absolute most abysmal live show I have ever seen. Not endorsing the band or any of their specific work here, just thought his quote was particularly interesting as it related to what is going on with the itunes sales data.
I'll admit that I buy single songs through iTunes. But that's usually because I'll get a gift card or something that can't cover the whole cost of an album. I personally own very few albums, but my dad and I share a similar taste in music and he owns at several hundred albums so I just burn what he's bought. If any of you are interested in a "rock opera" then Nightwish and Coheed & Cabria are very well known for telling stories throughout their albums.
Well... now that I got the Pumpkins out of my system today, tomorrow will have to be Coheed day thanks to Koreish.
As for abysmal live shows.... Weezer.... Oh god are they a waste to see live. Worst 40 bucks I ever spent. They don't even put on a show, the just stand there... no attempt to bring the audience into the show... nothing. Of course it didn't help that I had just seen Green Day about a month before. They are a fun band to see live (at least they were back in '02, I can't vouch for them now).
I have yet to listen to the entire Neverender saga; I finally got the last album only recently. I should do the whole thing one day.
coheed. So do my kids. Here's a picture of Kyle at his first concert ever, which happened to be Coheed & Cambria, which they LOVED. Claudio was thrilled to take a picture with a young fan:
Artists tell stories with their albums. Some artists take this further than others. My favorite band, Dream Theater, takes album storytelling to an astonishing level. You wouldn't buy a chapter or two from a film on DVD, so why only buy sections of an album?
Tomorrow I think I'm gonna setup a playlist of the Twelve-Step Suite. I really can't think of any other band that stretched a theme over five CDs. I know Kamelot's Epica and the Black Halo run together to tell a story, but they were write close together. The Twelve-Step suite goes back to '02.
I've seen weezer atleast 4 times now since 02, they arnt the wildest show you'll see, but their music isnt very heavy either, also, you really cant move around with a mic stand, all the members sing on most songs.
Greenday I've seen live via tv/streams, used to be good prior to the past 2 albums.
I pirated the newest album mainly due that I didn't expect it to be worth its $, and guess what it did suck. haven't listened to it since. actually I gave up about half way in. May give it another chance before I decide to delete or buy.
As for CD's I rip every cd I own, I have 7000+ songs on my mp3 collection, when I listen to music I generally set winamp to shuffle, though when I'm in a mood for sublime (right now) I crop my 40 tracks and set that to shuffle, or listen straight through.
In general 90% of my vinyl I own the cd to go along with it, I find it interesting to own the analog copy and let it play through with its pops n krackles.
Nate, your post needs a big IMO in front of it. I actually quite liked 21st Century Breakdown. It wasn't their greatest album (IMO that title still belongs to Dookie) but it was pretty solid. It seems like a pretty natural follow-up to American Idiot, the album flows well and it's entertaining. Then again, Green Day was the first band I ever really followed and listened to repeatedly... so I could be wrong.
I buy (yes actually buy) CDs but only from gigs. I go see a band, I buy the CD there. Bands a hell of a lot more cash from CDs sold at gigs than through a distribution chain.
I download the rest from iTunes or from other digital distribution mechansisms. Most of those are individiual tracks rather than the full album. It varies.
I'm with Shorty. About the only time I purchase music is at the show. I will, occasionally, pick up a full album from one of my favorite bands when they're not going to be touring in my area.
...After one album ends, I pick the next one I want to listen to. My "playlists" are chronological anthologies by artist. If it's time for Radiohead... it's time for some goddamn Radiohead.
I haven't purchased any music for myself since about 1997, and at that time I was buying everything from the local Disc-go-round (used CD store). I keep all those CDs in a binder in the basement, and primarily listen to my collection on my PC (I need to rip them all again, however, because I turned down the quality o save space when I ripped them the first time, years ago).
I used to listen to music the way Snark does: one album over and over until I'm done with it. They Might Be Giants (one of three bands for which I have the entire discography) are masters of album production. For some reason, in the late nineties my music collection reached a point where I had enough albums that a rotation among them never got boring, so I stopped buying more (although I still get enough as gifts to keep current on my favorites).
I would still listen to whole albums if only WinAmp had a "shuffle albums" command. However, my desire to not have to spend time choosing what to listen to next is stronger than my desire to hear entire albums together.
To answer the question of the original post; no, I don't think digital is
killing the "full album experience."
I do, however, think the album is possibly seeing the twilight of its years,
or at least the twilight of what we now know the album to be. And, I think
the reason for this lies directly with the consumer. It seems people in
general have no inclination to give any sort of music a second shot if it is
not immediately gratifying. I believe this is what leads to singles usually
being the only song that someone will go for, simply because it is seen to
be the most singlely gratifying song on an album. I mean why waste time with
all the other songs by an artist when you can just get your fill of them
with the couple best songs (i.e. singles) off the album? At least, that's
what I think tends to be the mentality of many.
I also agree that there are many musicians who don't release an "album's
worth of quality material," but personally I also think this is a weak
argument against the album. If someone is finding this to be the case on a
regular basis than I would be more suspect of their musical choices rather
than blaming it on the muscians or music itself. This is because there is
simply a ridiculous amount of incredibly talented musicians who can fill
albums and albums and albums worth of stellar music. I listen to music
literally about three-fourths of every day, I listen to it only in album
form, and I still never come close to being able to listen to everything I
want to. Heck, today I've already listened to three albums by the Clash with
one of them being spun twice (and I've only been working three hours).
At base, and I'm not trying to be an elitist here, but I usually suspect the
consumer first. I suspect them of not giving some music a chance or simply
not actively searching for new music. This is what leads to the "singles
only/I'll only listen to a few songs by the artist," or the "there are not
many musicians who make an albums worth of quality songs" metalities. Music,
of every shade and variety takes time to really grow into, to learn it's
intricacies and cul-de-sacs, to savor the hidden notes (and other such
retarded descriptions). It's like a good beer, or heck, beer in general. A
taste for it must be developed slowly, it must be learned. Yeah sure, you
can slug down a beer and think "That was okay." Or, you can take your time
with the beer in question, and other beers until you come to the point where
you really know and love that beer. The same for an album, the same for
music.
I think the real heart of the matter can be summed up by this;
Liking a song/songs vs. Liking music
*Oh yeah, props to Buddy J for mentioning Sufjan Stevens. Have you heard of
the Brooklyn-Queens Expressway film project he has been working on?
Yep. I'm pumped. There's a trailer film out that looks fantastic. As soon as Asthmatic Kitty puts it up for pre-order, I'm in. They're the greatest record company/distro as far as I'm concerned. Every time I order from them they're prompt, courteous, and partial to throwing in a little extra swag. :thumbup
Nice, I hadn't seen that trailer before. One of my friends is actually going to the film premiere in New York City, and in true Sufjan fashion they are doing a bunch of other neat stuff as well (one of them being a concert).
Asthmatic Kitty is a fantastic label, and along with Jagjaguwar it is one of my favorite labels.
*Call me an idiot but I have yet to really listen to Radiohead's latest album, though it's on the list.
I'm 21 and I haven't purchased a CD since probably 2001-02ish (I do the digital thing). The only full album sets I own are Led Zeppelin's.
I listen to a lot of rap and rock and since most of the rap out there now is complete garbage, I'm pretty selective when it comes to my collection. Most rap songs being played on the radio are the only ones worth listening to off that album. However, I think that some of the bigger stars in the rap game such as Nas and The Game have albums which you must listen through. Soulja boy is destroying rap. He's proof that the internet can take people with no talent, a couple catchy beats, "dance" moves, and then make millions for no apparent reason. I give him props for that, but I'd like anyone to say he has musical talent and back it up.
T-Pain has plenty of hidden gems on his albums. They're just not appropriate for radio. Three 6 Mafia's albums are all golden the older ones especially, but again can not be played on the radio.
It's muscians (if you can call them that) like Soulja Boy and Pitbull that are killing rap and ending it's era of supremacy on the air waves.
23 and I will buy single songs of things I like when I hear something on Pandora or get linked to a song. If I like more then one song I like to buy the full albums, 90% of my library are full albums.
I'm 28 and I buy a mix of full-length albums and singles on iTunes and Beatport, but I always buy full-length albums that I like on vinyl if they're available. This article is absolute garbage and crap and not true in the least bit. This is just the music industry's way of trying to hide the fact that there are underground artists everywhere, making better albums than they are, and handling all the A&R, distribution, recording, touring and everything else on their own. These days you have to sucker punch portly homosexuals just to get any attention on MTV and mainstream radio. Mainstream artists spend more money engineering terrible singers to make them sound good, and having their music videos made at Skywalker ranch than they do actually writing good music, or god forbid laying down a full-length album with even a theme, let alone a story. These are just sad pathetic cries for help from an ailing industry, if you want to hear real music support your local independent artists.
Talking on Twitter today about The Mars Volta: A phenomenal band that can really only be consumed on an album-by-album basis. There aren't any "singles" to be found on, say, Deloused in the Comatorium.
Talking on Twitter today about The Mars Volta: A phenomenal band that can really only be consumed on an album-by-album basis. There aren't any "singles" to be found on, say, Deloused in the Comatorium.
Exactly. I have all of there ALBUMS and been to a couple of there concerts when they opened for SOAD. There songs are sooo long you almost have no choice but to listen to the entire album in a single session.
After reading this post a few days ago, The Mars Volta was the first band I thought that had these epic albums you'd have to listen to from start to finish. Of course I didn't say anything since no one would probably know WTF I be talkin 'bout.
But for me, I rarely buy from itunes, and if I wanted to support a band, I do it the old fashion way of buying a CD and rip to MP3 since I'm careless with the CD. Last CD I purchased was MGMT, which actually turned out to be a gem since I only heard "Kids" up until then.
I will say this however, Pandora has killed any desire to purchase music. I'll throw a bone to support a band I like, but those occassions have been few and far between, since Pandora.
Sorry, I didn't mean to make it sound like they are new. I meant more specifically that The Mars Volta are a well known band, that's all (well, and that they have been well known for a while, and that's completely disregarding "At the Drive In").
I would still listen to whole albums if only WinAmp had a "shuffle albums" command. However, my desire to not have to spend time choosing what to listen to next is stronger than my desire to hear entire albums together.
Update: I found it.
If you go to the library and create an album only view, it adds an "Enqueue random album" selection to the context menu. Not as good as a permanent 'shuffle albums' toggle, but good enough.
Pink Floyd see's it my way. They had a clause in their contract that said the record company could not break their albums up. EMI did in fact do that for digital distribution, the band has sued and won.
Chalk up a victory for lovers of full length albums.
Comments
As for abysmal live shows.... Weezer.... Oh god are they a waste to see live. Worst 40 bucks I ever spent. They don't even put on a show, the just stand there... no attempt to bring the audience into the show... nothing. Of course it didn't help that I had just seen Green Day about a month before. They are a fun band to see live (at least they were back in '02, I can't vouch for them now).
Tomorrow I think I'm gonna setup a playlist of the Twelve-Step Suite. I really can't think of any other band that stretched a theme over five CDs. I know Kamelot's Epica and the Black Halo run together to tell a story, but they were write close together. The Twelve-Step suite goes back to '02.
Greenday I've seen live via tv/streams, used to be good prior to the past 2 albums.
I pirated the newest album mainly due that I didn't expect it to be worth its $, and guess what it did suck. haven't listened to it since. actually I gave up about half way in. May give it another chance before I decide to delete or buy.
As for CD's I rip every cd I own, I have 7000+ songs on my mp3 collection, when I listen to music I generally set winamp to shuffle, though when I'm in a mood for sublime (right now) I crop my 40 tracks and set that to shuffle, or listen straight through.
In general 90% of my vinyl I own the cd to go along with it, I find it interesting to own the analog copy and let it play through with its pops n krackles.
I download the rest from iTunes or from other digital distribution mechansisms. Most of those are individiual tracks rather than the full album. It varies.
Yes.
I used to listen to music the way Snark does: one album over and over until I'm done with it. They Might Be Giants (one of three bands for which I have the entire discography) are masters of album production. For some reason, in the late nineties my music collection reached a point where I had enough albums that a rotation among them never got boring, so I stopped buying more (although I still get enough as gifts to keep current on my favorites).
I would still listen to whole albums if only WinAmp had a "shuffle albums" command. However, my desire to not have to spend time choosing what to listen to next is stronger than my desire to hear entire albums together.
killing the "full album experience."
I do, however, think the album is possibly seeing the twilight of its years,
or at least the twilight of what we now know the album to be. And, I think
the reason for this lies directly with the consumer. It seems people in
general have no inclination to give any sort of music a second shot if it is
not immediately gratifying. I believe this is what leads to singles usually
being the only song that someone will go for, simply because it is seen to
be the most singlely gratifying song on an album. I mean why waste time with
all the other songs by an artist when you can just get your fill of them
with the couple best songs (i.e. singles) off the album? At least, that's
what I think tends to be the mentality of many.
I also agree that there are many musicians who don't release an "album's
worth of quality material," but personally I also think this is a weak
argument against the album. If someone is finding this to be the case on a
regular basis than I would be more suspect of their musical choices rather
than blaming it on the muscians or music itself. This is because there is
simply a ridiculous amount of incredibly talented musicians who can fill
albums and albums and albums worth of stellar music. I listen to music
literally about three-fourths of every day, I listen to it only in album
form, and I still never come close to being able to listen to everything I
want to. Heck, today I've already listened to three albums by the Clash with
one of them being spun twice (and I've only been working three hours).
At base, and I'm not trying to be an elitist here, but I usually suspect the
consumer first. I suspect them of not giving some music a chance or simply
not actively searching for new music. This is what leads to the "singles
only/I'll only listen to a few songs by the artist," or the "there are not
many musicians who make an albums worth of quality songs" metalities. Music,
of every shade and variety takes time to really grow into, to learn it's
intricacies and cul-de-sacs, to savor the hidden notes (and other such
retarded descriptions). It's like a good beer, or heck, beer in general. A
taste for it must be developed slowly, it must be learned. Yeah sure, you
can slug down a beer and think "That was okay." Or, you can take your time
with the beer in question, and other beers until you come to the point where
you really know and love that beer. The same for an album, the same for
music.
I think the real heart of the matter can be summed up by this;
Liking a song/songs vs. Liking music
*Oh yeah, props to Buddy J for mentioning Sufjan Stevens. Have you heard of
the Brooklyn-Queens Expressway film project he has been working on?
Hell yes.
<object width="400" height="225"><param name="allowfullscreen" value="true" /><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always" /><param name="movie" value="http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=5682252&server=vimeo.com&show_title=0&show_byline=0&show_portrait=0&color=&fullscreen=1" /><embed src="http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=5682252&server=vimeo.com&show_title=0&show_byline=0&show_portrait=0&color=&fullscreen=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowscriptaccess="always" width="400" height="225"></embed></object><p><a href=" BQE- A Film By Sufjan Stevens</a> from <a href="http://vimeo.com/asthmatickitty">Asthmatic Kitty</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com">Vimeo</a>.</p>
Yep. I'm pumped. There's a trailer film out that looks fantastic. As soon as Asthmatic Kitty puts it up for pre-order, I'm in. They're the greatest record company/distro as far as I'm concerned. Every time I order from them they're prompt, courteous, and partial to throwing in a little extra swag. :thumbup
Asthmatic Kitty is a fantastic label, and along with Jagjaguwar it is one of my favorite labels.
*Call me an idiot but I have yet to really listen to Radiohead's latest album, though it's on the list.
I listen to a lot of rap and rock and since most of the rap out there now is complete garbage, I'm pretty selective when it comes to my collection. Most rap songs being played on the radio are the only ones worth listening to off that album. However, I think that some of the bigger stars in the rap game such as Nas and The Game have albums which you must listen through. Soulja boy is destroying rap. He's proof that the internet can take people with no talent, a couple catchy beats, "dance" moves, and then make millions for no apparent reason. I give him props for that, but I'd like anyone to say he has musical talent and back it up.
T-Pain has plenty of hidden gems on his albums. They're just not appropriate for radio. Three 6 Mafia's albums are all golden the older ones especially, but again can not be played on the radio.
It's muscians (if you can call them that) like Soulja Boy and Pitbull that are killing rap and ending it's era of supremacy on the air waves.
Exactly. I have all of there ALBUMS and been to a couple of there concerts when they opened for SOAD. There songs are sooo long you almost have no choice but to listen to the entire album in a single session.
After reading this post a few days ago, The Mars Volta was the first band I thought that had these epic albums you'd have to listen to from start to finish. Of course I didn't say anything since no one would probably know WTF I be talkin 'bout.
But for me, I rarely buy from itunes, and if I wanted to support a band, I do it the old fashion way of buying a CD and rip to MP3 since I'm careless with the CD. Last CD I purchased was MGMT, which actually turned out to be a gem since I only heard "Kids" up until then.
I will say this however, Pandora has killed any desire to purchase music. I'll throw a bone to support a band I like, but those occassions have been few and far between, since Pandora.
*Or at least I know what you're talking about.
Update: I found it.
If you go to the library and create an album only view, it adds an "Enqueue random album" selection to the context menu. Not as good as a permanent 'shuffle albums' toggle, but good enough.
Pink Floyd see's it my way. They had a clause in their contract that said the record company could not break their albums up. EMI did in fact do that for digital distribution, the band has sued and won.
Chalk up a victory for lovers of full length albums.