Building a new PC.

candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
edited July 2012 in Hardware
I'm building a new PC (my current has an OEM HP mobo and I don't even want to try upgrading w/ that) with these parts:

mobo: Biostar TA970XE $70 (rebate)
CPU: AMD FX 4100 Black edition $100
Graphics card: AMD Radeon HD 7770 (1GB of GDDR5 mem, its a Sapphire something) $140 (rebate)
HDD: Barracuda Green 1 TB (6 GB/s SATA) $100
CD/DVD: some generic internal burner $15
Case: PowerSpec TX-606 $25
RAM: 2x 4GB DDR3-1333 (generic) $35

Total: $485

Any changes you think I should make (or something I completely missed)?

Comments

  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Geeky, in my own way Naples, FL Icrontian
    Well, Gigabyte for motherboard probably. Biostar is a poor/fair mobo maker, fair at best, randomly poor.
  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    From what I've read this is one of their better mobos (both of the reviews on the microcenter site gave it 5/5). Also its a good price and has everything I want.
  • shwaipshwaip bluffin' with my muffin Icrontian
    what are you planning on using this computer for? (gaming - what games? just internets/word processing?)

    You'll need a psu. Don't forget, you'll also need a windows license.
  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    Oh yeah, I have a 430W PSU already, and I'm considering buying Win7 (otherwise I have an XP install disk).
  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    I'll be doing games (though I'll use the internet as well) probably SR3, TF2, and MC (that's what I play now but SR3 and, TF2 lag).
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Geeky, in my own way Naples, FL Icrontian
    Ok, I read the reviews. Only two of them, but they rave about what they have done ina short time with that board. I would say to OC stably it is a fair board, but OCing means heat increase in case which can lead to heat damage.

    Look at ECS for heat-stable mobos, or Gigabyte for good solid quality reputation and heat stability. If you do not want to to OC, the this BIOSTAR board is a POSSIBLE candidate for a year or so of durability. The rest of your pick is not OC probable, the quality is not gonna be heat stable probably.

  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    What would you suggest from ECS or Gigabyte, I was hard pressed to find the same features for a similar price.
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Geeky, in my own way Naples, FL Icrontian
    Since ECS and Gigabyte have a better overall reputation, you pay more for their boards. Look for similar features, and pay the going rate, please. You will join converts to them who are happy over a longer term-- if that is part of your system build goal set.

    I would say Biostar 1 year with no OCing-- max(from dreadful experience with them, had a board that was cheap from them last 90 days and they would not replace it because I admitted I OCed it 10%).

    ECS or Gigabyte boards should allow some OCing if you buy things instead. They should last 2-3 years stably while doing so. Problem is to determine how long you want to spend for, then cost per year of machine use, versus technology growth and change speed.

    @Thrax , maybe, will chime in with specific motherboard recommendations when he gets time. I know Intel systems better and will not stick my neck out for AMD build recommendations specifically.
  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    I would like to have it as long as possible (probably no OC'ing so I could use the warranty) and be able to just upgrade parts (RAM, CPU, GPU) to keep it running fast without getting an entirely new PC every 1-2 years.
  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    Also, I don't exactly have lots of money to throw at this (saving for has taken me awhile so I'd like to keep the price about the same).
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Geeky, in my own way Naples, FL Icrontian
    I understand you have limited funds. I cheat, I buy other than the most recent tech, and hang about 2-3 years behind bleeding edge when I do buy. That lets me buy discounted but reliably reviewed parts.

    For what you want to do, as far as goals for your system, it depends a lot on how long you can live with the same system. If you are one who wants to upgrade like crazy over 2-3 years as to RAM and such, do NOT buy a cheap motherboard and buy a case that will let you have lots of fans added to it and which is spacious. You want the BEST motherboard as that is the CORE of your system (the CPUs will change as you upgrade if you get a motherboard now that supports bleeding edge CPUs AND older CPUs). The CPU is almost part of the core, but not quite true core.

    To use an extended similie set, which helped me when I started out, the CPU is system heart, but hearts need muscular nourishment also, which means out of a body they cannot live. Bodies have circulation systems, CPUs need power and power supply and motherboard team to power CPU right like body systems power heart. CPU, truely, is more like BRAIN than heart. BRAIN is core of thinking, but needs lots of fine physical things to keep working well.

    I cut some corners on a Folding@Home dedicated computer, and including Windows spent about $900.00 on it. I spent on a CPU that was NO LONGER state of the art about $329.99.

    The motherboard and case and PSU I bought cheap. They will go first. The CPU will transfer to a new motherboard when the motherboard power circuitry goes. I bought the motherboard for a year's use. That is the expensive long-haul way to go. BUT, I wanted a dedicated folding box NOW (as of 5-6 months ago).

    You need to decide if you will cut corners and replace more in a year or buy for two-three years. Totally different strategies apply for that than for 1 year max buys.
  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    I have never had a computer that broke within 2 yrs of purchase. I don't usually do much overclocking or other lifespan-shortening things, and I just don't understand why you are convinced that it will break within 2-3 yrs.
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Geeky, in my own way Naples, FL Icrontian
    Um, mfr'd machines by say HP are designed to last 2-3 years, though most are NOT designed to upgrade at all easily.

    When you build your own computer, or buy a custom one, you need to look at the part mfr reps also. Part mfrs sell things for as much as they can get away with and keep a market. Biostar positions itself as a Value motheboard mfr and value these days means average one year lifespan. Gigabyte and ECS now, and MSI to a little lesser degree, make Enthusiast boards, which are designed to last 3 years or more for 90% or more of them. For the enthusiast boards, Gigabyte offers a 3 year replace or repair warranty. They stand by that warranty.

    ECS is starting to do this a lot also, indeed they are promoting a 4-day turnaround for replacement if their boards fail and have some boards designed to run day-in and day-out at 50 C.

    I cannot fairly, given my experience, recommend Biostar.

    I have an MSI mil-spec motherboard in my folding box, it is not using a video card at all-- it depends on the video from the CPU for video. It is NOT a gamer's computer.

    The temp in this bedroom is 81 degrees farenheit tonight. It was higher today, I am not liquid cooling anything. Ceiling fan is on high.

    Value computers are simply not designed for hugely high temps in room they are in. They like 70-76 degrees. Enthusiast computers stand up to more heat better and longer-- plain and simple. I learned this over 30 plus years of building computers, and talked folks into better components for that reason alone.

    Value computers also are not designed for high humidity. They like 10-20% humidity at most for most of their running lives.

    Enthusiast computers stand up to higher humidity also. they use no ordinary steel, and the best enthusiast grade motherboards use gold plated contacts so they do not corrode where contact is made in reasonably high humidity of 50-70% for a lot of the running time.

    We have air conditioning, the high was 94 degrees Farenheit today. the A/C ran about 70% of the time-- another $250.00 electric bill for this month, it looks like. I live in Florida, we get such bills about 8 months of the year and this is only a small 2-bedroom house. So I know what heat and humidity can do to value computers, they combinedly destroy them fast down here.
  • shwaipshwaip bluffin' with my muffin Icrontian
    edited July 2012
    Despite the fact that straight_man is a bit rambly (and much of his reasoning is bullshit), his main point is accurate. "Enthusiast" parts tend to have their drivers/bios updated a bit more frequently, and may have more support near their end of life (say when you want to upgrade your processor).

    Many people on this forum like gigbyte/msi/etc because we're enthusiasts/overclockers/etc BUT also because they tend to have better support, more tweaking options in the bios. Often they include more robust components for overclocking and as a side benefit these components also tend to last longer.

    Biostar motherboards tend to be lacking in the ability to tweak anything in the bios (beyond boot options/etc). If that's important to you, you may want to look at a more expensive board (gigabyte tends to be one of the best options).

    Personally, I'd spend a little bit more on the crucial system components (CPU/RAM/MOBO/GPU) to ensure that my machine would last the 2-5 years you want it to before you need to upgrade things.
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Geeky, in my own way Naples, FL Icrontian
    As to my reasoning is bullshit:

    I skip things because I take them for granted based on knowing them to be repeatedly true from experience and often state what others think are conclusions regarding building while for me they are build rule sets. Also brevity requires logic gaps. And, no-one is a computer God-- definitely including me. I otherwise leave gaps so as not to kill a discussion totally, leaving things for others to contribute. I am an old guy, older than most here, and formally trained in verbal logic but not math logic (Terrible with math.).
  • shwaipshwaip bluffin' with my muffin Icrontian
    You say that, but you don't include any real, logical information.

    Biostar positions itself as a Value motheboard mfr and value these days means average one year lifespan.
    (cite)

    I cannot fairly, given my experience, recommend Biostar.
    (what experience? what information other than your anecdotes?)

    I have an MSI mil-spec motherboard in my folding box, it is not using a video card at all-- it depends on the video from the CPU for video. It is NOT a gamer's computer.
    (what does this have to do with the current question?)

    The temp in this bedroom is 81 degrees farenheit tonight. It was higher today, I am not liquid cooling anything. Ceiling fan is on high.
    (useless info)

    Value computers are simply not designed for hugely high temps in room they are in. They like 70-76 degrees.
    (cite)

    Enthusiast computers stand up to more heat better and longer-- plain and simple. I learned this over 30 plus years of building computers, and talked folks into better components for that reason alone.
    (you know what the first 27 years of that experience means at this point? Pretty much nil. No one cares if you can manually set all the IRQs to minimize/remove conflicts anymore)

    Value computers also are not designed for high humidity. They like 10-20% humidity at most for most of their running lives.
    (cite)

    Enthusiast computers stand up to higher humidity also. they use no ordinary steel, and the best enthusiast grade motherboards use gold plated contacts so they do not corrode where contact is made in reasonably high humidity of 50-70% for a lot of the running time.
    (ordinary steel? WTF. Also, now we're onto the highest-end parts for a computer that's going to play older games?)

    We have air conditioning, the high was 94 degrees Farenheit today. the A/C ran about 70% of the time-- another $250.00 electric bill for this month, it looks like. I live in Florida, we get such bills about 8 months of the year and this is only a small 2-bedroom house. So I know what heat and humidity can do to value computers, they combinedly destroy them fast down here.
    (This is useless info).

  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Geeky, in my own way Naples, FL Icrontian
    When I was a pro builder, for one year my boss tried to use Biostar boards. I told him not to, but had no stats. We got 10 corroded and shorted out lumps of junk back during that year, from irate customers and Biostar recompensed us nothing(we also built higher end systems). My boss switched to Intel boards. We mostly built, then, for home-schoolers and small businesses.

    What makes Enthusiast boards Enthusiast boards is better quality. Folks are coming to realize that these boards also last longer. By getting Value systems where they cut the wrong corners in specifying the computer. The computer dies in 90 days to a year. Say the generic PSU dies. If it dies catastrophically due to being surged, it can easily surge the mainboard, the RAM, the CPU, the South and North bridges, etc. So, don't buy a real cheap PSU. Same for motherboard, if a motherboard that is cheap is surged it dies in its power circuitry often.

    TANSTAFL is a base buying principle my father drummed into me. It applies to computers hugely.

    As to hugely high end materials like gold, 3 micron thin plating is now useable on some areas of contacts. ECS and MSI are using this kind of process, or buying parts made with it. I have had to chemically clean RAM socket contacts that were corroded, replace soldered-on batteries where they electrolytically were corroded, and so on. So, non-electrolytically reactive and more expensive stuff also has the side benefit of being less corrodable by moist air.

    Enthusiast machines have more fans, because folks want more fast. This means more heat. The fans also blow moist air away from things faster. They corrode less. cheap way to baby cheap stuff.

    As to babying cheap motherboards, they have to be power babied also, because power circuitry details are corner cut areas for costing.

    The MSI Mil-Spec motherboard I got? It was $69.95 from Newegg, but intended for Intel. Where did MSI cut corners? On the chipset-- the board has a chipset designed for SATA II stuff at best. The video is limited also. It is not a gamer's board. The power circuitry? High grade. the contacts were mostly gold-plated.

    The last main full use computer I built ran me $1500.00, in year 2000 dollars. I got one of the oldest video cards the computer could support and a VGA NEC flatscreen for it-- cut corners and spurged, where experience said (for my use goal set )I could do so.

    MY current main-use computer? A laptop, Lenovo Thinkpad W520, one of the oldest subrevisions. It works fine, though I do not game with it. It ran me $1,500.00 and is a desktop replacement laptop that is an older submodel so Lenovo discounted it to me for about $1000.00 off. I got a 3-year extended warranty for it in the price.

    What does that say to the case in point? You have to know what you are doing to build for yourself or buy at discount these days. I have been trying to teacxh someone who will have increased needs out of his computer where NOT to cut corners, and perhaps teach future readers also. So I appear to ramble. Sorry, Deal With It!

  • mertesnmertesn I am Bobby Miller Yukon, OK Icrontian
    Back to @candreasen...

    ECS does not currently make a true AM3+ motherboard, which would have a 900-series chipset. The closest they have is the A890GXM-A2 2.0, which would be fine as long as you're not overclocking. You'd do better to go with a Gigabyte motherboard such as one of these.
    Generally speaking, Gigabyte has a much better reputation than Biostar.

    Since you're not doing overclocking, you'll probably be fine with your original Biostar motherboard.

    I would definitely consider a bigger power supply. AMD recommends a minimum of 500W for the Radeon HD 7770. A 430W PSU might work, but you're likely pushing the upper limits of what it can do. I would highly recommend going with a good quality PSU as well - this is one component that should never be skimped on since it's providing electricity to your entire system. A bad PSU can wreck an entire computer in an instant (worst case) or possibly not be able to supply its advertised wattage (more likely) which would cause problems as well. Jonnyguru is an excellent resource for finding both excellent and terrible power supplies. This guy has PSU test equipment that I could only dream of owning. If he says a supply is good or bad, you can be 100% sure his opinion is accurate.
  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    Thank you mertesn, I think the one I have (bought to replace one which started on fire in an older custom build) is probably bad quality (based on some googling it is a Linkworld model LPJ2 which seems to get bad reviews everywhere, jonnyguru even had a slightly lower quality version that he reviewed/destroyed as more or less an example of a terrible PSU) and I'm still looking for a PSU that is fairly cheap and around 500W (maybe a bit more). Any recommendations for a PSU or something else (though please stop it with the mobo @Straight_Man I know it isn't that great, but I wanted to know if I had put something extremely overpriced and or low quality in my machine, not that you dislike the one I chose based on your past experience, and also why would you continue to argue that I shouldn't get that mobo after saying that you know Intel boards better and wouldn't even recommend one?) Whew long parentheses.
  • Straight_ManStraight_Man Geeky, in my own way Naples, FL Icrontian
    Um, I said I would not recommend BIOSTAR as mfr-- I buy Gigabyte or MSI Intel chipset mainboards for myself. I do not buy Intel brand mainboards. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
  • TushonTushon I'm scared, Coach Alexandria, VA Icrontian

    Thank you mertesn, I think the one I have (bought to replace one which started on fire in an older custom build) is probably bad quality (based on some googling it is a Linkworld model LPJ2 which seems to get bad reviews everywhere, jonnyguru even had a slightly lower quality version that he reviewed/destroyed as more or less an example of a terrible PSU) and I'm still looking for a PSU that is fairly cheap and around 500W (maybe a bit more). Any recommendations for a PSU or something else (though please stop it with the mobo @Straight_Man I know it isn't that great, but I wanted to know if I had put something extremely overpriced and or low quality in my machine, not that you dislike the one I chose based on your past experience, and also why would you continue to argue that I shouldn't get that mobo after saying that you know Intel boards better and wouldn't even recommend one?) Whew long parentheses.

    PSU List on newegg (there is a reason those Seasonics are on top) (@mertesn is absolutely right about johnnyguru recommendations, but I hate navigating that site)

  • candreasencandreasen Minneapolis, MN
    Thanks Tushon, I'll look at that because his site is really odd and I would love to be able to see info like the price without digging for several minutes per board I look at.
Sign In or Register to comment.