processor glass ceiling?

entropyentropy Yah-Der-Hey (Wisconsin)
edited May 2004 in Hardware
i have my 2.8 at 3.23 right now, and i'm prime95'ing it to double check it's integrity. i tried nudging it 3.26 and it booted, but didn't test it. then i got it to 3.3 and windows just took a crap on me right when starting up. so, i turned the ram to a 2/3 ratio (in my bios it's listed as 1.66, which i took to mean 2/3) still no good. i'm just wondering if i can get it any higher, because this is most definitely not a temp problem ... even at 3.2 i idle at about 22*C. as of the minute i'm writing this, my fsb is set it 232. that puts my bus at 927.8 (i think the strange number may be due to MIB:memory intelligent booster...should i turn that off?). my ram timings are set to By SPD. now, i just realized i could play with voltages, but that makes me incredibly nervous, and i wouldn't know if i should up the ram or the cpu voltage. i think i'm stable a 3.23 right now cuz prime hasn't found an error in the last 20 mins or so. so, upping my voltages on the cpu will raise the temp by how much approximately? so, a summary:

1)can i go any higher?
2)if so, how?
3)kill MIB?
4)how much, per increment, will my temps go up and what effect does upping the voltage have on the cpu?
thnx all :)

Comments

  • TheBaronTheBaron Austin, TX
    edited April 2004
    your ram is good up to 2.8v at least - its corsair, dont worry about it.
    if you're stable at 3.23 with your cpu then you can probably squeeze some more mhz out of it by upping the vcore, i'd think (assuming you're using a good HSF) that 1.6v vcore - AT LEAST - is completely fine. however, when you hit a ceiling where you need big vcore raises for small speed raises, THEN you've hit your ceiling
  • MedlockMedlock Miramar, Florida Member
    edited April 2004
    I had OC'd my 2.8 to 3.2 recently. At stock voltage it was unstable, but while it did run it ran at temperatures comparable to stock speed. I upped the voltage a bit (I forget how high it was now) and the temps were much higher. At stock speeds it runs at 50-51*C under load. @3.2 w/ increased voltage it ran in the mid 60's at a full load.
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited April 2004
    You may or may not have hit the ceiling. (How's that for a definitive answer! ;D )

    OK, some questions?
    What is your CPU temp at your achieved overclock?
    What speed is your DRAM? PC3200? Manufacturer? Brand?
    What power supply unit do you have? Probably not a limiter if you're running OK at 3.23GHz.)

    Boosting voltage on the DRAM won't hurt it at all. The default memory voltage adjustment increments built into the board/BIOS are not large enough to cause damage.

    Try boosting both DRAM and CPU voltages two notches each. If you achieve a higher, stable overclock, you can always back off the voltage and test for stability. (Please do though, report your temperatures before boosting CPU voltage.)

    OCs on P4 Northwood 2.8s average around 3.2, but 3.4 is not all that uncommon. I can get an almost stable 3.6 out of mine, but I've got a very well-ventilated case and an above average 2.8.

    BTW, stable overclocked Northwoods in hyperthreading mode are monster Folders. :D
  • entropyentropy Yah-Der-Hey (Wisconsin)
    edited April 2004
    right now running prime 95, stock voltage, it's wavers between 38/39/40*C. well, people have told me that it's prolly too low, so it may not be entirely accurate. i'm using the stock hsf, and if i can't push my processor much further, i won't waste the money on a high quality one, as this seems to be doing it's job just fine right now. also, i just got an error in p95.
    Self-test 8K passed!
    FATAL ERROR: Rounding was 0.5, expected less than 0.4
    so i think i'll knock up the voltage, watch the temps and try again...but bumping it doesn't have any adverse effects, does it? (it won't kill my cpu more than just regular overclocking?)
  • edited April 2004
    The amount of temp increase will be directly related to 2 things, the actual amount of vcore increase and also the cooling solution you are using. If you are using an Intel stock hsf, then you will definitely need to keep an eye on temps as you up the vcore. If you are using a premium hsf like a SLK with a SmartFan 2, then you will be good to go for a ways. Northwoods can handle up to 1.60v with no problems at all and 1.65v with a premium air cooled solution and some folks will stretch them up to 1.7v with watercooling. I run mine at around 1.625-1.65v with SLK's with a Delta FFB0812SHE on my primary rig and a Panaflo H1A on the IS7 rig, which I'm about to change out to a SF2. My folding temps on my primary rig are at 51 C with a system temp of 27 C right now.
  • entropyentropy Yah-Der-Hey (Wisconsin)
    edited April 2004
    right now, after p95 is off and idleing, mbm5 reads 22*C at 3.23 ghz.
    pc3200 ddr Corsair Value Select ram, not sure what brand the chips themselves are but i can check.
    power supply is a 500W Ultra.
    i think i'll up the ram and cpu one voltage notch each and try again (will post temps as well) if that doesn't work, i'll go one more and try again. but i'm not sure how far i want to mess with that.
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited April 2004
    Sorry, I replied too fast - didn't notice the "60's" temp you posted above. Based on the fact that you're using the stock cooler, and that Prime 95 wasn't passed completely, you probably don't want to go above 3.2. At higher overclocks, the CPU just demands good superior cooling. The stock Intel cooler is actually a quality unit, just not designed for increased heat stress on the CPU.
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited April 2004
    right now, after p95 is off and idleing, mbm5 reads 22*C at 3.23 ghz.
    I think your motherboard is not telling you the truth. :banghead: I just can't see that temp unless your case temp is about 10*C.
  • MedlockMedlock Miramar, Florida Member
    edited April 2004
    Umm... Hey Leo, I don't think you replied too quickly. It was me that said 60's, not entr0py.
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited April 2004
    OK, I'm just all hosed up! And I didn't have my evening glass of wine yet! Too young to be loosing it this soon...
  • entropyentropy Yah-Der-Hey (Wisconsin)
    edited April 2004
    right so this is odd. i played around w/mbm5 and the sensors it uses, and all the sudden, i have the case set for ITE8712F-2 Diode, and it shows 98*C! not only that but it _does_ fluctuate between that and 99, so it must be an accurate reading from somewhere. that scares the crap out of me, the fact that there could possibly be a 100*C location in my computer, when in fact there isn't. the cpu is for ITE712F-3 Diode, and it reads 21*C right now. so i got suspicious. i took of my side panel, told it to shut down, and waited. i knew hsf dissipate heat very quickly, so the second i saw the lights on my fans blink out, i touched the top of the hsf. holy crap. it was like i had it sitting on the counter. totally room temperature, not even a SLIGHT difference, if anything, it was cooler. also, the temperature in my room right now is 22.5*C. so, now i'm worried. then i went into bios, and watched the temperature in there. it sat at about 26/27*C. this gigabyte is a nice board, but they need to work on their sensors. (note: any other sensor i try that's available in mbm5 either says 25*C or 0*C)

    \\EDIT: when running p95, i selected blend. i did get an error once in memtest86, so after i let prime run for a bit on 3.2 ghz (i declocked it some) i'll try selecting the first option, where very little ram is tested and see what happens.
  • TheBaronTheBaron Austin, TX
    edited April 2004
    if your cpu is at 100% then that 100C could be accurate with the stock cooler, but i dont think theres any way in hell that its your cpu temp
  • entropyentropy Yah-Der-Hey (Wisconsin)
    edited April 2004
    it can't be my cpu temp, it would've melted lol. i mean, i'm all for a fast processor, but not if it's dripping down my motherboard. i think that temp is just off, as is the rest of my system's sensors. it's entirely stable at 3.20, and unless i go play w/voltages a bit, this should be ok i suppose...too bad i can't get it any faster though. btw, that was at idle lol
  • edited April 2004
    If you are running the latest version of MBM, you can just run the wizard and select your mobo and the correct monitoring parameters should then be set. It's a real timesaver when setting up a new rig.
  • MedlockMedlock Miramar, Florida Member
    edited April 2004
    TheBaron wrote:
    if your cpu is at 100% then that 100C could be accurate with the stock cooler, but i dont think theres any way in hell that its your cpu temp
    :bs:
    What, are you high? Maybe 100*F, not C. He says room temp is 22.5C. I don't know what that equates to in *F, which is what I go by here in the US. :D Anyway, I use a stock cooler. My processor's been runnin' 100% for a few days now and I haven't yet hit 54*C/129*F. It hangs around 51*C/123*F, sometimes though, it'll get up to 53C/127F. Basically the same story when I actually had this thing OC'd, just a 1-2* difference with no voltage changes.

    I think we're both in the same boat entr0py. 2.8's stuck at 3.2 until someone gets a new HSF. (I've been considering the sp-94.) Not that that's a bad thing! 400 free MHz is really cool! :thumbsup::leet:


    :usflag:
  • entropyentropy Yah-Der-Hey (Wisconsin)
    edited April 2004
    room temp is somewheres around 70*F (i use it F too lol but no one else does) i tried running memtest86, and get 2 errors on test #5. then i upped the voltage .1v and about the same. went to .2v and i got a mere 72 errors (!!!) i'm pretty sure my ram is holding me back. i also turned off MIB cuz it gave me more errors when it was on (i assume because it was dynamically overclocking it). i'm really regretting not spending an extra $20 or so on high quality ram, but it's too late now. btw, my mobo won't let me overvolt my ram more than +.3v :(
  • entropyentropy Yah-Der-Hey (Wisconsin)
    edited April 2004
    do you think if i changed the timings (loosened or tightened) it could help?
  • MedlockMedlock Miramar, Florida Member
    edited April 2004
    I can't answer that one, I don't know anyting about ram timings. I've run mine by spd from day 1.
  • SimGuySimGuy Ottawa, Canada
    edited May 2004
    If you want to see how far your CPU can go, drop the timings to 3-4-4-8, crank the RAM voltage to 2.8 or 2.85V and drop your memory divisor to 3/2 (DDR266).

    Only at those settings will you figure out how far your CPU can actually go (well, at least on your current cooling setup) without your memory holding you back.
  • entropyentropy Yah-Der-Hey (Wisconsin)
    edited May 2004
    HAHA i swear, two threads almost a month old each of mine just got revived today. well, truth be told i've got different ram now, and i can't change my timings at all. it's geil ddr500 at 2.5-4-4-7 i believe, which isn't bad at all. i haven't tried pushing the proc more because it's getting quite a bit warmer out round here and we don't have air conditioning lol i think, if i got a new hsf, i could get to 3.4 and topple over
  • MedlockMedlock Miramar, Florida Member
    edited May 2004
    Good idea lieshi's got, but I wouldn't be overclocking right around now with this stock hsf. Case temps are just too high right now. A fairly steady 35*C/95*F right now...
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