GeForce FX Controversy Continues

Omega65Omega65 Philadelphia, Pa
edited September 2003 in Science & Tech
<a href="http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=11492&quot; target=_blank>The Inq: Valve Speaks, Nvidia skewered</a>
While it was no secret to anyone that NV30 performance wasn't all that great, NV35 is looking increasingly leaky as things go by. First we had the 3DMark 2003 controversy (where Nvidia's poor Pixel 2.0 performance first came to light). A lot of people actually blamed this one on a bad benchmark on FutureMark's part, and considering that 3DMark '03 isn't actually built on a game engine, that criticism had some teeth.

Then some enterprising MIT youngsters found a way to get Nvidia's very impressive "Dawn" demo running on ATI hardware (a supposedly "impossible" feat according to Nvidia) only to find that it actually ran faster under ATI's hardware than Nvidia's.
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Just how bad are things? Pretty bad. Even the Radeon 9600 Pro out-paces the GF FX by over 50%, while the Radeon 9800 Pro doubles the FX's feeble 30 fps. These are in benchmarks without AA or AF enabled. The game isn't even playable on anything below an FX 5900.

What about Nvidia's claim that the FX benefits dramatically from optimized code? It might be true, but it won't save the situation. While GF FX 5900 Ultra performance did increase a fair amount from optimization, the 5200 and 5600 are still completely unplayable and barely benefited—though this may be because these two designs are, in fact, based upon the even-worse-performing 5800 Ultra design. This isn't really a solution either, since it took Valve 5 times as long to code the Nvidia specific data as the general DX9 path. Valve's solution at the moment? Run the GF FX series as a DX8 part.

<a href="http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=11492&quot; target=_blank>MUCH more here</a>

Comments

  • Omega65Omega65 Philadelphia, Pa
    edited September 2003
    <a href="http://www.tech-report.com/etc/2003q3/valve/index.x?pg=1&quot; target=Blank>TechReport.com: Valve lets off steam over NVIDIA performance</a>
    As you can tell from looking at the list in the slide above, Newell was concerned particularly with some of the techniques NVIDIA has used in recent driver releases, although he didn't exempt other graphics hardware makers from his complaints. He said they had seen cases where fog was completely removed from a level in one of Valve's games, by the graphics driver software, in order to improve performance. I asked him to clarify which game, and he said it was Half-Life 2. Apparently, this activity has gone on while the game is still in development. He also mentioned that he's seen drivers detect screen capture attempts and output higher quality data than what's actually shown in-game.

    Newell summed up his problem with bad benchmarks in a nice zinger line: <b>"Our customers will be pissed."</b>

    <a href="http://www.tech-report.com/etc/2003q3/valve/index.x?pg=1&quot; target=Blank>3 Page Article here</a>

    ================================

    Things are not looking good for Nvidia....:scratch:
  • SimGuySimGuy Ottawa, Canada
    edited September 2003
    Where's Kenneth Star to launch an inquiry into NVidia's "foul play" :D
  • TemplarTemplar You first.
    edited September 2003
    Then some enterprising MIT youngsters

    Guess what line I was about to throw out for this one? :) I guarantee nVidia is thinking the same thing.
  • TekGamerTekGamer Earth
    edited September 2003
    yeah they managed to run a nvidia only demo on Ati hardware.... and it runs faster on ati then nvidia...

    nvidiots you need to jump from that sinking ship...


    Tek
  • SimGuySimGuy Ottawa, Canada
    edited September 2003
    TekGamer said
    yeah they managed to run a nvidia only demo on Ati hardware.... and it runs faster on ati then nvidia...

    Tek

    Works damn well too :D

    You can also view the "scantally clad" version of dawn (with or without her wings) by renaming the dawn.exe file to either 3dmark03.exe or quake.exe :D
  • Geeky1Geeky1 University of the Pacific (Stockton, CA, USA)
    edited September 2003
    Got a link to a version of the demo that'll work on an ATi, or a guide as to how to make it work or something? I'm at work, so I have nothing better to do ;D
  • NecropolisNecropolis Hawarden, Wales Icrontian
    edited September 2003
    Went on a bit of a search. Found this link

    http://www.rage3d.com/articles/atidawning/
  • TheSmJTheSmJ
    edited September 2003
    I wonder if it's at all possible to run the demo on a DX8.1 part.

    In the past such a backstep was possible with these demos (before the FX, actually).
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