To Dual core or not to Dual Core (AMD)

bloucksbloucks Missouri
edited February 2006 in Hardware
I am upgrading my computer and I am torn between which processor I need to go with. I do work my computer hard (HL2, BF2, COD2, Visual Studio, Office, Adobe), but I usually only do one thing at a time. It it worth going dual-core now? Or is it one of those things that can wait two years until some software is created for it?

AMD Athlon 64 4000+ San Diego 1GHz FSB Socket 939 Processor $334.00
vs
AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ Manchester 1GHz FSB Socket 939 Dual Core $295.00

eVGA 256-P2-N518 Geforce 7800GT 256MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card Bundled with:
eVGA 133-K8-NF41 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI ATX AMD Motherboard
for $339.00

Thanks for any insight. :aol:

Comments

  • ArmoArmo Mr. Nice Guy Is Dead,Only Aqua Remains Member
    edited February 2006
    that 4000 is way more powerful than the 3800+.

    i use a 4200+, but i do like 9 things at a time. it workes very well, i use folding @ home at 100% and i do video conversions, music, web, movies, games all at once, lol its been fantasic.

    firefox explodes using dual core for a long time, i have problems with animated GIFs, other than that the 4200 is very fast. but for single program use that 4000 will probably do you better.
  • RWBRWB Icrontian
    edited February 2006
    I love my dual core 3800+ :rockon:
  • muddocktormuddocktor
    edited February 2006
    If you get a dual core proc you will find your computing habits changing a bit, IMO. Whereas before you would only do 1 thing at a time, now you will find that you are ripping a vid or mp3 + gaming + folding at the same time and don't see any degredation in performance. Plus, you can always overclock the X2 3800 (or Opti 165) to the same speed as a stock sandy 4000+ without too much problem so you will still have good gaming performance. Monarch and Newegg both have an Opteron 165 for less than $330. The Newegg one is retail box and the Monarch one is an oem. The Opteron 165 has 1 MB L2 cache for each core, just like a sandy 4000 has 1 MB L2 cache for it's core.
  • bloucksbloucks Missouri
    edited February 2006
    muddocktor wrote:
    Monarch and Newegg both have an Opteron 165 for less than $330. The Newegg one is retail box and the Monarch one is an oem. The Opteron 165 has 1 MB L2 cache for each core, just like a sandy 4000 has 1 MB L2 cache for it's core.

    I am a Database administrator and I have been away from the hardware stuff for a little while, so bear with me.

    Ok how does the Opteron compare to the Athlons? For example:

    AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ Manchester
    vs
    Opteron 165 (I am clueless on the Opteron)
  • ArmoArmo Mr. Nice Guy Is Dead,Only Aqua Remains Member
    edited February 2006
    the opterons are server class hardware, EXTREMELY fast and reliable. its like the jump from a single core to an X2, thats relative to the jump from an X2 to an Opty 160
  • bloucksbloucks Missouri
    edited February 2006
    Newegg has this one for $325. Will this beat the socks off the processors that I mentioned before?

    AMD Opteron 165 Denmark 1GHz FSB 2 x 1MB L2 Cache Socket 939 Dual Core Processor - Retail
  • muddocktormuddocktor
    edited February 2006
    That's the processor I was referring to. At stock speed, it will run approximately the same as the X2 3800 (even though it's clocked 200 MHz slower than the 3800, due to the extra L2 cache). But overclocked, it should run rings around either the 4000+ or the X2 3800. The socket 939 Opterons all have 1 MB L2 cache per core versus the 512 kb L2 cache of the X2-3800. This will let you realize a 3-10+% increase in performance versus the X2 3800 at the same clock speed, depending on the app.

    The only difference between the socket 939 Opteron (both single and dual core versions) and the San Diego or Toledo A64 processors is that they have been much more thoroughly tested for stability, since they are server class chips. This extra testing has been found by the overclocking community to show that they generally overclock quite a bit better than the A64 processors. Of course with overclocking, your mileage may vary because it's just a roll of the dice on an individual processor's overclocking ability, but with the Opterons you tend to have better odds of getting a better overclock.
  • Sledgehammer70Sledgehammer70 California Icrontian
    edited February 2006
    Opty's are nice chips, but to drop cash on a single core would be pretty stupid these days as most new software will be utalizing the dual Core setups.... a 4200+ would be the better buy but you might want to wait a month as the new M2 socket set is rolling out and the current 939 chips will mst likely see a drop in price once again! the 3800+ has issues with games "like BF2 and COD2" but for the most part with the way the industry is headed there is nothing to justify a single core purchase!

    GO Dual Core

    4200+ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103547
    4400+ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103546
    4600+ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103545
    4800+ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103544
  • bloucksbloucks Missouri
    edited February 2006
    Sledgehammer70 wrote:
    Opty's are nice chips, but to drop cash on a single core would be pretty stupid these days as most new software will be utalizing the dual Core setups.... a 4200+ would be the better buy but you might want to wait a month as the new M2 socket set is rolling out and the current 939 chips will mst likely see a drop in price once again! the 3800+ has issues with games "like BF2 and COD2" but for the most part with the way the industry is headed there is nothing to justify a single core purchase!

    GO Dual Core

    4200+ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103547
    4400+ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103546
    4600+ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103545
    4800+ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103544


    This Opteron is Dual Core. The link you gave me is for Athlons Dual Cores and are priced higher. I am thinking about buying the Opteron and getting a good aftermarket cooling solution so I can overclock it. I would love to be able to wait, but my current setup is DOA right now and I'm getting cranky without my Day of Defeat and Batterfield 2 fix everyday :mean: . There are some commies and nazi's that need to be taken care of!!
  • Sledgehammer70Sledgehammer70 California Icrontian
    edited February 2006
    That is becuase I am reccomending those CPU's over the Opty! you can get a 4200+ around the same price as a Opty!
  • deicistdeicist Manchester, UK
    edited February 2006
    Yes, but the optys are dual core too, and tend to clock higher than the X2s.
  • bloucksbloucks Missouri
    edited February 2006
    Sledgehammer70 wrote:
    That is becuase I am reccomending those CPU's over the Opty! you can get a 4200+ around the same price as a Opty!

    Oh ok...now I get it. I can see the value in the 4200+ over the Opty, but can see the reason to go with Opty. Too many options so little money!:scratch:

    What do you think about that EVGA motherboard/video card offer?

    eVGA 256-P2-N518 Geforce 7800GT 256MB GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card
    with a free:
    eVGA 133-K8-NF41 Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI ATX AMD Motherboard

    Thanks to all for your insight!! This is great help and an excellent discussion!
  • Sledgehammer70Sledgehammer70 California Icrontian
    edited February 2006
    the EVGA mobo is by far a not so good OC'er! I bought that same deal and ended up using the mobo as a tester.... it has options but is nothing like a ASUS or DFI mobo!

    with all the research I did between the Opty and the X2's I found the X2 to be the better deal/ better chip. Over all it performs better, and if you buy into the 4800+ or 4400+ you get 1MB cache per core like the Opty's. I have seen the results benchmarks etc.,. ask anyone I had threads of 15 pages when I was trying to comapre the 2. I ended up with a 4400+ x2 along with a few 4800+'s
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited February 2006
    I have not used either the X2 or Opteron dual core CPUs, but I can attest to the superiority of 1MB per core L2 cache levels. My D820 has that. It's awesome, it's immediate.
  • bloucksbloucks Missouri
    edited February 2006
    Sledgehammer70 wrote:
    the EVGA mobo is by far a not so good OC'er! I bought that same deal and ended up using the mobo as a tester.... it has options but is nothing like a ASUS or DFI mobo!

    with all the research I did between the Opty and the X2's I found the X2 to be the better deal/ better chip. Over all it performs better, and if you buy into the 4800+ or 4400+ you get 1MB cache per core like the Opty's. I have seen the results benchmarks etc.,. ask anyone I had threads of 15 pages when I was trying to comapre the 2. I ended up with a 4400+ x2 along with a few 4800+'s

    Thanks Sledgehammer for your suggestions!
  • reelbigfishreelbigfish Boston, MA Member
    edited February 2006
    The extra cache may or may not help. It does greatly for people like Leo and me since we have Intel dual cores. I have the Pentium D 930 and the 2MB of cache per core helps a lot. As for AMD, I don't think the extra cache is worth the price you pay for it. With the Athlons shorter pipeline, you aren't slowed as much when you have a cache miss and need to access main memory, mainly due to the Athlons on chip memory controller.

    As for dual core in general, it's worth it. It makes doing every day tasks more fun as you can do pretty much anything, like burn and do something else unlike a single core.
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited February 2006
    Ohh, good point. I hadn't considered that. It's really time I do another AMD rig. Perhaps next summer.
  • tmh88tmh88 Pittsburgh / Athens, OH
    edited February 2006
    http://www23.tomshardware.com/cpu.html im sure youve seen this, but it really really helps.
  • NightwolfNightwolf Afghanistan Member
    edited February 2006
    Dual core.
  • Mt_GoatMt_Goat Head Cheezy Knob Pflugerville (north of Austin) Icrontian
    edited February 2006
    The larger L2 certainly helps on the X2 and Dc Opty's. Folding runs noticeably faster with the larger cache! My DC Opty runs circles around the X2 I had and all the past CPU's for that matter. Can you say smmmooooooth? ;) I can run 2 instances of folding, rip a DVD, have a few browsers open and run Photoshop all at the same time better than I could do any one of the above by itself before.
  • QeldromaQeldroma Arid ZoneAh Member
    edited February 2006
    For me it's not whether to dual core or not (I'm decided dual core) ... it's how long I should wait.

    With this being a breakpoint year in the marketing of dual cores, in a couple of months ... :bigggrin:
  • bloucksbloucks Missouri
    edited February 2006
    Just to give an update. I purchased a AMD 4200+ Dual Core and I have no regrets. It runs everything faster than ever and my HL2 Games scream now. Of course the Geforce 7800GT doesn't hurt either. Thanks for all your input!
  • robgunnerrobgunner Far away from anywhere
    edited February 2006
    i installed my new dual core friday and i love it,keeps up all the way....
  • muddocktormuddocktor
    edited February 2006
    I am glad to hear that you are enjoying your new system. I fell in love with the smoothness of a dual processor system 3 years ago with my old AMD dually but it wasn't a gaming champ. These new DC AMD (and Intel too, if you can live with the power consumption and heat) processors bring to the table both worlds. The smoothness of a dual processor system with the use of regular consumer motherboards (cheaper and highly overclockable) just can't be beat. :thumbsup:
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