Need advice for PCI-Express card

DantespeakDantespeak
edited December 2006 in Hardware
It took a new video card for me to realize I've been living under a rock for the past 5 years.

TES 4: Oblivion comes out and I went out to buy a ATI x1900xt. Problem is, it doesn't fit in my AGP slot, because it's a PCI-Express. I assumed every new card is AGP standard since AGP held the crown for awhile. I never even heard of PCI-Express until today.

So I'm looking for a solution. A practical one. One that doesn't involve me returning the game or the video card :tongue2:.

I'm aware that a new motherboard is required. I've never purchased a motherboard in my life, since all my computers have been pre-built with them. Question is, whats the most affordable motherboard I can buy that is reliable at the same time? And can I move all my old hardwares over to the new motherboard (processor, power supply, memory sticks etc.) without causing any conflicts? It's an intel 4 processor, so I assume I have to get an intel motherboard? What else should I be aware of when buying a new motherboard?

Anyone who can answer these questions would be great!

Comments

  • Mt_GoatMt_Goat Head Cheezy Knob Pflugerville (north of Austin) Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    What socket and memory do you have? This will have a lot of bearing on the possibilities! It is even possible that PCI-E may not be available with you current CPU and/or memory. :(
  • primesuspectprimesuspect Beepin n' Boopin Detroit, MI Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    You CAN get an AGP card that will play that game beautifully.... Post your specs and as mtgoat said, we'll go from there.
  • tmh88tmh88 Pittsburgh / Athens, OH
    edited March 2006
    Yea the nvidia 7800GS is supposed to be very nice.
  • Sledgehammer70Sledgehammer70 California Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    Spec's are good :) and yes from the 6800GS and the 7800GS you can get awesome gaming performance... for about $200 cheaper than the X1900XTX. But if you want high end you will need a new mobo....
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    I'm aware that a new motherboard is required. I've never purchased a motherboard in my life, since all my computers have been pre-built with them.

    But we could change all that! I suppose you've noticed that many of us build our own computers. Hey, it's not for everyone, but it is fun and you get computers tailored for the exact employment you wish.
  • jradminjradmin North Kackalaki
    edited March 2006
    I have a feeling your running on a socket 478 chip, and if thats the case they ya...you'll need a new MOBO and a new CPU. Thats gonna run you around $500-600 if your looking to get mid range - lower high end (oxymoron!) card.

    If you don't want to spend all that, then go with the GS series like everyone else has stated. Its basically a 7800GTX core cut in half.
  • TheSmJTheSmJ
    edited March 2006
    The 7800GS is underpowered for its price IMO. I'd stick with a 6800 Ultra, or GS if you feel like overclocking.
  • DantespeakDantespeak
    edited March 2006
    I'm indeed running on a Socket 478.

    It's a Dell PowerEdge 400sc model, with 2.4Ghz and 1.00GB of Ram.

    The card I'm currently using is a FX 5900. Even on the lowest settings, Oblivion has severe framerate problems :tongue2:.

    Hope I didn't leave anything out.
  • jradminjradmin North Kackalaki
    edited March 2006
    Your only recourse is the 6800GS or 7800GS pretty much.
  • DantespeakDantespeak
    edited March 2006
    I'm laid with two choices I gather.

    - buying a new PC for the $500-$600 range, which would effectively boost my total cost to about $1k.

    ~or~

    - trade in the x1900xt for a 6800gs / 7800gs as many here are suggesting and end up saving about $650

    Although the second choice is a lot cheaper, how well will those specs fare in 3-5 years compared to the first choice?
  • primesuspectprimesuspect Beepin n' Boopin Detroit, MI Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    in three to five years, they will both be outdated pieces of crap that will not play any current games...

    Think about what was new three years ago :eek3:
  • Sledgehammer70Sledgehammer70 California Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    Well same goes for the X1900XTX 3-5 years anything on the market will crap with the current hardware cycles...
  • DantespeakDantespeak
    edited March 2006
    That's true. I may have over exaggerated my years a bit. Basically, I'm looking to last as long as my fx 5900 did, which ran all my games fine until now. I think it was released about 2 years ago. I could be wrong. I'm a full time student with a tight budget. I doubt I could afford to upgrade every six months (or however long these cards take to release these days.)

    Right now I'm looking at a $650 pc:
    AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 3800
    1GB of DDR memory
    PCI Express x16 slot
    250GB 7200RPM hard drive
    Dual DVD drives
    PCI Express x16 slot

    Since it uses the same memory sticks, I can transfer my old over and get a modest 2GB of ram.
  • jradminjradmin North Kackalaki
    edited March 2006
    Ok... my advice (and I hope people agree =P) is to get a GS card and save up some money for a new system in a year or 2. I think that GS card will get you through this year and most of next year OK, but its going to be very iffy after that. Not just because of the vid card either, but pretty much the entire computer. AGP support is only going to get small and smaller till there is no more AGP period, so I would do what you can with the smallest amount of $$ now and save up for an entire new rig down the road in a year or so.
  • Sledgehammer70Sledgehammer70 California Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    Dantespeak wrote:
    That's true. I may have over exaggerated my years a bit. Basically, I'm looking to last as long as my fx 5900 did, which ran all my games fine until now. I think it was released about 2 years ago. I could be wrong. I'm a full time student with a tight budget. I doubt I could afford to upgrade every six months (or however long these cards take to release these days.)

    Right now I'm looking at a $650 pc:
    AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 3800
    1GB of DDR memory
    PCI Express x16 slot
    250GB 7200RPM hard drive
    Dual DVD drives
    PCI Express x16 slot

    Since it uses the same memory sticks, I can transfer my old over and get a modest 2GB of ram.

    If you are a true gamer you will not want the 3800 X2, unfortunately most games like BF2, FEAR, and a dozen other have major issues with that chip for some reason. I myself have been looking into the issues and can't figure it out. I have no issues with my 4200+, 4400+ or my 4800+ just with the 3800+ ... setting the affinity to 1 seems to solve the issue. But until AMD or the game maker creates a fix for this some of these games, It will cause you major head aches.
  • lemonlimelemonlime Canada Member
    edited March 2006
    Sledgehammer70 wrote:
    If you are a true gamer you will not want the 3800 X2, unfortunately most games like BF2, FEAR, and a dozen other have major issues with that chip for some reason. I myself have been looking into the issues and can't figure it out. I have no issues with my 4200+, 4400+ or my 4800+ just with the 3800+ ... setting the affinity to 1 seems to solve the issue. But until AMD or the game maker creates a fix for this some of these games, It will cause you major head aches.

    Really, that is very odd.. The 4200+ is based on the exact same core (Manchester) so I find it odd that it would be a hardware issue. Is this just on your system Sledge, or a widespread problem?
  • jradminjradmin North Kackalaki
    edited March 2006
    Socket M is coming out soon, and that means 939 prices will probably go down. I would hold off on any new systems until then unles you just cant wait that long.
  • DantespeakDantespeak
    edited March 2006
    Sledgehammer70 wrote:
    If you are a true gamer you will not want the 3800 X2, unfortunately most games like BF2, FEAR, and a dozen other have major issues with that chip for some reason. I myself have been looking into the issues and can't figure it out. I have no issues with my 4200+, 4400+ or my 4800+ just with the 3800+ ... setting the affinity to 1 seems to solve the issue. But until AMD or the game maker creates a fix for this some of these games, It will cause you major head aches.

    I could be saving myself from a disaster if that's true.

    Can anyone else confirm this?
  • Sledgehammer70Sledgehammer70 California Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    lemonlime wrote:
    Really, that is very odd.. The 4200+ is based on the exact same core (Manchester) so I find it odd that it would be a hardware issue. Is this just on your system Sledge, or a widespread problem?

    This is wide spread, read it at the BF2 forums, FEAR forums and other games. the 3800+ has caused some issues all around. before I staked my claim I tested the chip on 4 mobo with 100% different setup and got the errors in BF2 and fear 90% of the time. It would allow the games to run and get into the game and at misc. points would just close the app. Once Affinity was set to 1 the issue never occured.
  • DantespeakDantespeak
    edited March 2006
    Alright, I'm going to purchase the

    EVGA 7800gs
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814130275

    and return the x1900xt. PCI-E is way more trouble than it's worth ATM.

    Thanks every one.
  • Sledgehammer70Sledgehammer70 California Icrontian
    edited March 2006
    Good deal let us know how it works out for you...
  • JavisJavis
    edited December 2006
    Hi there folks

    I would really appreciate if someone could help me out on a related issue. I also have no PCI-Express slots on my motherboard. I am trying to buy a SATA drive now, so that if I upgrade my PC, I can just transfer the harddrive.

    I downloaded PCI Sniffer, which gave me a report showing every bus device with the following: Cacheline: 0 * 32 bit.
    There were no 64bits.
    I believe v2.1, 5V Conventional PCI is 32bits, whereas v2.2, 3.3V Conventional PCI is 64bits.

    Question: Am I correct in assuming that all my PCI slots are therefore v2.1
    Question: Am I correct in assuming any PCI cards I buy must be v2.1 compliant
    Question: Finally, can anyone please identify the slot in the attached picture, and what it would be used for. It doesn't look like any I'm familiar with.

    Thanks
    Javis:whatever:
  • PterocarpousPterocarpous Rosie the Riveter Lives On in CA, USA! New
    edited December 2006
    Javis wrote:
    ...I am trying to buy a SATA drive now, so that if I upgrade my PC, I can just transfer the harddrive...

    The other folks will help you w/ the PCI-E issue. I'll comment on the txfr of HDD... If you mean you plan to pull your HDD that is running your primary/OS partition and install it to a new system and expect it to boot right up, that won't work - at least not w/o a fight. The OS will detect the major hardware change and hang b4 booting into the desktop. You'd have to perform a/run sysprep b4 you txfr the drive and even then I'm not sure if it'd work. If someone knows a way to make this work I'd sure be interested! :smiles: (If you're talking about txfring a drive that contains no OS partitions, then you shouldn't have any trouble.)
  • JavisJavis
    edited December 2006
    Sorry I don't understand "txfring"?

    I don't think the drive will be the issue. It won't have an OS on it. It will be my secondary drive. I currently have a 500GB drive plugged into a regular IDE channel in a common motherboard, found in a P4 Dell Computer.

    I plan on buying a PCI card with some SATA connectors on it. The guy at SEagate (where I'll be buying my secondary drive) suggested using a PCI controller card. So I'll connect this new SATA 500GB drive to the PCI card.

    The problem is
    a. I don't know if my motherboard PCI slots are v2.1
    b. If there are any PCI cards out there with SATA II compatibility, which will slot into regular conventional PCI slots. I have found the Highpoint ROCKETRAID1740 4-CH SATAII 3GB, but it's $120, which is a little more than I wanted to pay just to connect up my new drive.
  • PterocarpousPterocarpous Rosie the Riveter Lives On in CA, USA! New
    edited December 2006
    Javis wrote:
    Sorry I don't understand "txfring"? ...

    Sorry 'bout that. It's my habit to drop all or most vowels in order to abbreviate. Started using txfrmr (transformer), txfr (transfer), etc. when I worked in the simulation systems industry years ago. Old habits die hard.

    Your absolutely right. No problem w/ transferring a data drive to your new system. My mistake. :rolleyes2 I've often had people ask me if they could move their HDD to their new system so I assumed that's what you had in mind, too.

    I have a SATA controller on ea. of my systems and they work nicely. One controller is a combination IDE and SATA controller. I use them to support removable drive bays. The controllers plug into PCI slots. I forget the SATA and PCI versions, though. Would have to dig out my mobo manuals and documentation on the SATA controllers.

    Please, let us know what you find so others dealing w/ a similar issue (PCI 2.1 expansion cards on older systems)
  • RWBRWB Icrontian
    edited December 2006
    PCI is PCI.... PCI Express is PCI Express... SATA is SATA....

    Pretty much meaning, if you're going to buy an SATA HDD and you're motherboard doesn't have it, then all you need to do is buy a PCI based SATA Controller Card like this one, and plug it into any available PCI slot.

    Mind you, the linked SATA Card is just whatever I saw first at newegg... I don't know how good it is. Out of stock ATM anyways.
  • RWBRWB Icrontian
    edited December 2006
    Also as for that un-ID'd slot, it almost looks like a 64bit PCI slot with a missing groove... I don't know.
  • danball1976danball1976 Wichita Falls, TX
    edited December 2006
    Could that be an AGP Pro slot? What brand is your motherboard, Javis? Take a look at the printing on your motherboard, if you could, that'll help us determine what that slot is.
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