Best Bang for the Buck

Daxx

Looking for feedback on value builds for maximum folding production from both Intel and AMD camps. There are some cheap processors out there, but a lot of those are power hogs. More efficient processors usually come with a higher price tag, but at some point they might pay for themselves with smaller electric bills from both power draw and returned heat into my cooled space.

Who can make some value builds that have the best folding production when divided into the cost of operation?

Thanks!

Leonardo

One requirement that immediately becomes apparent - dual core. I'll start our analysis by listing dual core CPUs that are available for under $200. (Prices are as of 26 Jul 06, from Newegg, MWabe, or Monarch Computers, retail CPUs, shipping not included.)

Intel (all D series require DDR2 memory/motherboard):

1) D 805: $101, very good overclocker, hot, limited bandwidth, power hungry
2) D 820: $123, VERY GOOD overclocker, hot, good bandwidth, power hungry
3) D 915: $140, good/very good overclocker, hot, limited bandwidth, power hungry (65nm, less power consumption and heat than D8XX series)
4) D 930: $190, SUPERB overclocker (4GHz on air is not uncommon), hot, power hungry (65nm, less power consumption and heat than D8XX series)
5) D 940: $191, same overall as D 930, except default clock is higher, overclocking will not be any different at the final clock.

AMD:

1) A64X2 3800+: $153, good overclocker, low power consumption, low heat, great bandwidth

2) A64X2 4200+: $188, limited overclocker, low power consumption, low heat

On eBay, I know you can find the 805, 820, and 930 for much better prices than online retail.

AMD experts, please give some help here. If my AMD comments are inaccurate, please correct me.

For Folding@Home potential production, AMD dual core and Intel D 8xx and 9xx series seem to run nearly on parity, with the exception of QMDs (none seen in months) and double Gromacs. GBGromacs and many standard Gromacs are processed fairly equally on competitive AMD and Intel platforms.

If you wish to keep your CPU for a year or less, I think your best bang for the buck would be an Intel 805, 820, or 930/940 system. If for longer than a year, depending on your electricity prices, it would probably be advisable to go Athlon 64X2. If you already have spare DDR(1) RAM you wish to put in a new system, then Intel D series is probably out for you. IF QMDs and Double Gromacs are available in plentiful supply, ANY of the Intel systems will be superior points producers to the Athlons. Fair or unfair, that's just the way it is. (Gaming is an entirely different story. :o )

Garg

A Core 2 Duo E6300 would be great bang-for-buck. Should use less power than a Pentium D or an Athlon 64, too. The problem is that they're in short supply right now, but they should be less than $200 when supply stabilizes.

Omega65

Core2 Duo Mobo prices will be high and the CPU will have limited availablity for the near future.

A Cheap AM2 X2 3800+ with DDR2 should be upgradeable to a Quad Core K8L late next year.

Leonardo

A Cheap AM2 X2 3800+ with DDR2

What's a mid-grade or budget board that supports X2 3800 AND DDR2? Remember, the focus on this thread is not on building a high performance Folding box, it's best dual core bang for the buck - on a budget.

Omega65

I would go with the usual suspects for midrange AM2 OCing mobo

DFI INFINITY NF ULTRAII-M2 Socket AM2 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra $110
(should be moddable to 8x/8x SLI)

EPoX EP-MF4ULTRA Socket AM2 NVIDIA nForce4 Ultra $92

Daxx

Leonardo wrote:

What's a mid-grade or budget board that supports X2 3800 AND DDR2? Remember, the focus on this thread is not on building a high performance Folding box, it's best dual core bang for the buck - on a budget.

I've had my eye on this one from Biostar:
BIOSTAR GEFORCE 6100 AM2 Socket AM2 NVIDIA GeForce 6100 Micro ATX $62.99 Retail. Sometimes they have open box values for half that price.

This board pretty much has it all. If only X2 3800+ CPU's were the same price as 805D's, this would make a very good value deal for processing power vs. power consumption.

Leonardo

I think a 3800 at 25% overclock will will have about the same production level as a D805 at 25% overclcock unless Double Gromacs or QMDs are being assigned, in which case the 805 would leave the 3800 behind. The AMD advantage in this case is the 3800 will consume about 40-50% less power and will put much less heat into the room.

Do you know if that Biostar mobo has much overclocking potential? I know that the $101 D805s will overclock like crazy on several i945p chipset boards.

Daxx

Leonardo wrote:

I think a 3800 at 25% overclock will will have about the same production level as a D805 at 25% overclcock unless Double Gromacs or QMDs are being assigned, in which case the 805 would leave the 3800 behind. The AMD advantage in this case is the 3800 will consume about 40-50% less power and will put much less heat into the room.

Do you know if that Biostar mobo has much overclocking potential? I know that the $101 D805s will overclock like crazy on several i945p chipset boards.

Good point about the power. In the long run (how long?) the 3800+ could become the cheaper processor due to power savings. It's the "invest more now to save more later" conundrum. So now we have initial cost vs. power consumption vs. time to help determine the best value system.

I don't have the Biostar above so I can't say much about it -- it just looks like a decent board (specs) for the price. As for the i945 chipset, which motherboards do you recommend for the value system?

Leonardo

For me, the save now/save later argument is answered - go Pentium D series if someone else pays for power, or if you pay for power yourself, use D series only as an interim solution - no more than 12 to 18 months. The latter is what I'm doing.

Budget LGA boards for D series processors:

(these boards will NOT accept Conroes, but will accept the D8 or D9 series Pentiums)

Look for 945G, 945P, or 955 chipsets for overclocking. Do not overclock a D series CPU if the motherboard doesn't have heatsinks on the MOSFETs around the CPU socket. NO NO. Donut and I have both smoked motherboards by doing that. Literal smoke. The best clocking board for D Series is the Asus P5W series, but they unfortunately, are not "budget."

I'll get back to this thread later with specific recommendations.

Omega65

The TForce Series is Biostar's OCing range of mobos.

BIOSTAR TForce 6100 AM2 Socket AM2 $74

TForce 6100 Review

citrixmeta

also, it doesnt hurt to hunt around the forums and pickup a cheap amdxp+mobo combo for a few bucks

Leonardo

Biostar board - no micro boards for me. I hate them.

Citrix, why would I want to pick up a cheap AMD XP + mobo combo when that is exactly what I want to upgrade away from? In fact, if things go as I hope I will posting for a sale a cheap AMD XP combo for sale in a couple weeks! :bigggrin:

citrixmeta

that post what directed at Daxx

muddocktor

Leo, my AMD DC's do very well with Dgro wu's also, but both my are 1MB cache models (X2-4400 and Opty 170). They average around 800-900 pts/day with DGro wu's and I kind of doubt that an 805 or 820 will just leave them in the dust, folding-wise. Now QMD is a different story, but I don't look for those to come back for a long time, if ever.

Leonardo

OK Mudd, good point. I would imagine the AMD DCs, just as you said, are much efficient with Gromacs than the old XPs.

muddocktor

Oh yeah, much more efficient, Leo. Remember, they have SSE2 just like the P4's and unlike with QMD work, SSE2 isn't disabled on the DGro work. So they do fly through them pretty well.

I've heard that before the QMD work dried up, some folks had hacked the F@H client and disabled the AMD check and got SSE2 enabled with QMD work and they did very well folding QMD's, but with the same provisions as with the P4 by just having 1 client on QMD and the other on regular work to keep from flooding out the memory bandwidth.