Computer Always freezing
Mr_Bojingles
Northern Michigan New
I am having a problem with a friends computer with it always freezing. It doesn't matter if I am in a game or windows, it usually freezes after a short time. This computer was recenlty built form all new parts and has been having this problem since.
The mobo is a DFI Lan Party with the nforce2 ultra chipset, 2500 barton, and radeon 9700 pro.
He has two new sticks of Geil pc3200 (256mb each) I have tried each one individually and then brought a stick of my ram over which I know works fine because I pulled it from one of my computers.
I have updated the videocard and nforce drivers to the newest version. Heat is not an issue as it is running around 50 celsious.
He is using a raidmax 350w ps (came with the case)
Could it be a bad mobo? Or is it something else?
to all who help!
The mobo is a DFI Lan Party with the nforce2 ultra chipset, 2500 barton, and radeon 9700 pro.
He has two new sticks of Geil pc3200 (256mb each) I have tried each one individually and then brought a stick of my ram over which I know works fine because I pulled it from one of my computers.
I have updated the videocard and nforce drivers to the newest version. Heat is not an issue as it is running around 50 celsious.
He is using a raidmax 350w ps (came with the case)
Could it be a bad mobo? Or is it something else?
to all who help! 0
Comments
-thats what prime wants to say:D
also check the voltages in the bios, see if the 12, 5, and 3.3 are in spec
I'll give it a shot at see what happens.
Still awaiting your answer
No overclocking is being done. The computer has only been built for a couple weeks from all new parts so a reformat I don't think would do much.
I just checked the temp. and it was at 36 celsious. So when my friend checked it he must of doing something that was making the cpu think hard just before he wrote the temp down.
But alas, no floppy disks or blank cds can be found in the house right now
Also I would by a 400w or better PSU one that has >20A on the 12v rail. pssst check sig below
One thing I noticed was that memtest couldn't tell me how much L2 cache his barton had. I don't know if that means anything, but thought I should throw that in there.
IF no errors, look at the FSB settings, soem BIOSs reset FSB and DRAM timing to a default as follows:
FSB 100 MHz.
DRAM base timing 100 MHz.
BOTH should be 166 MHz for good hardware. Also, if you get HD errors before freeze, chack the cable and the way it is connected, to HD and all other things on IDE bus,ok???
But total errorless lock is usually timing or overheating of something.
John-- who had the primary master HD connector work loose day before yesterday, got all sorts of freezes, and it was not heat, though a set of other issues makes me have an SLK-900 on the way, and a fan, and soem more of the very GOOD and cheap copper sheilded ATA\133 PcToys EIDE round cables from CoolerGuys.com.
And are you running that 9700 pro on the cat 3.9's when you say latest version?
Yes, it is the 3.9's i am using for the 9700 pro.
When his computer freezes there is no errors at all. It just freezes as is.
One thing I thought was odd was when I was running 3dmark03 over and over. On the third time I was running it, and I believe it was the nature scene, the screen froze but the frame counter kept going. I tried to esc/crt-alt-del but it then just totally locked up.
Ageek: I will try some the things you suggested when I am at his house tomorrow. Unfortunalty I don't have the computer at my place right now. I am pretty sure both the ram and the processor are running at 166mhz.
I believe this is the ram he has:
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?DEPA=1&submit=Go&description=GE2563200
John.
John.
I double checked my ide connections and unplugged and plugged everything back in.
I was unable to get the heatspreaders off to look at the ram itself, so I couldn't confirm if the geil name was on them.
When i was in halo the game froze but it kept looping a second or two of sound. but everything else was froze. Another time halo totally lost its sound but I could still play. I went into the nvidia control panel for sound with halo minimized and then the computer froze on me. It seems totally random...
I then went into to safe mode for 10-15 minutes and the computer never froze.
What gets me is that I tried a stick of my own ram from my own computer the other day and it still was freezing in jason's computer. I know my stick works fine because I have been using it for several months without trouble.
I have unistalled both the videocard and nvidia nforce drives and re-installed them with no luck.
Currently the ram timings are at: 2.0-7-4-4 (mobo optimal default)
And these are on a sticker on the ram itself: 2.5-6-3-3
I am not to familer to playing around with ram timings, but what would be recommended?
EDIT\\mistyped ram timing
Disable LPT2 port settings, IE printer port SHOULD NOT BE using IRQ5. Sound cards LIKE IRQ 5. Make usre modem is not set to COM 5, IRQ 5 (Compaqs with cheap modems added LOVE to do this, go online, play sound, computer locks, typically with PCTel modules. Half the folks with Sound Blasters and PCTel modem cards (chip mfr will be PCTel) have to go to something else for a modem, like an external modem or a USR modem that will accept other IRQs than 5.
Next, if sound is embedded, PULL the modem if can, or disable in BIOS. Bet part of problem if not most of it vaporizes on modem removal. POSSIBLE defective modem if modem not new or even if so.
Also, on modern boards IRQs 9, 10,and 11 are typically already stacked, no way do you want modem or sound on any of those IRQs.
John-- mini-ABC on resolving IRQ stacks for sound and modem and possibly LPT2.
Open the side of the case and blow a fan on the video card and run it. Prolly thats the problem
I don't believe it is a heat issue because I was playing max payne 2 last night for about 30 min on jasons computer with no problem. I called him today and told him to play max payne 2 and checked back and he told me he played it for 1 1/2 hours with no problems.(everything is maxed in graphic settings 1280x1024)
Also, last night, I booted it into safe mode and just let it sit there for 2 hours, and it didn't freeze.
But if you are in windows normally it will usually freeze in under 20 mins usually(time varies), even if you boot it up and just let it sit there without doing anything.
I looked in bios last night and I believe all the IRQs are automatically assigned, so I left it at that.
The only time his computer doesn't seem to freeze is when the computer is in safe mode or in max payne 2.
I have installed and re-installed the latest nforce drivers twice. I believe there are version 3.13.
On the other hand, I have generally found that the symptoms you describe are usually a heat issue, with memory a close second. (Memory usually reboots your computer; heat freezes the screen).
When I do that, at least I can rule that out if it still freezes.
Then I will open the case up and point a fan at it like gnomewizardd suggested.
Just the whole being able to play max payne 2 without it ever freezing baffels me...
Gnome's idea is an excellent one. It's the quick & easy way to troubleshoot heat problems.
The Max Payne 2 thing is just weird, but would indicate a driver problem. Maybe it just avoids a certain driver call that other games do not.
Good luck!
(PS - Head over here and get your prize.
BTW... it's better for it to be freezing than boiling, so I wouldn't complain, especially not if it's that cold all the time...
After windows was done the only thing installed was the nforce drivers. No problems there. So I then installed the ATI drivers, but it started to freeze again.
I system restored to the orig. windows install and just installed the ATI drivers. No problems.
So there is some sort of conflict between the nforce drivers and ati drivers. I disabled both tray icons for ati and nvidia and it still froze.
I then found a system process called ATI something or another that was listed under the user "system" and stopped that which in turn ended a process by the same name but by the user "jason". It seemed to do the trick as windows stopped freezing and I was messing around with half-life and had no problems.
Hopefully the problem is now fixed
Thanks for everyones help.
And, the ATI taskbar and ATI monitoring interferes with too much software. Which is why I am saying goodbye to ATI for now, until they get their software tuned for 32-64 bit a bit better. Good hardware, basicly, drivers STINK versus nVidia reference drivers unless some of the bells and whistles they toss in are removed manually AFTER install.
Probbaly, with the nforce media bridge drivers running, the ATI drivers could not mod DirectX. The installer does not grok how to talk abuot that kind of issue, so ATI says to switch from an nVidia card to an ATI you first remove the nVidia drivers, and the reverse also holds true. The nForce chipset was tuned for use with nVidia cards, different DirectX strategies used. That is underlying why in this case, I bet. Since card behaves with the nforce tuning in place and what you removed is experientially not needed, leave any ATI glitz off of the nForce chipsets and just use the driver core stuff.
I also have had to remove SOMETHING from every Radeon support software install I have ever made to get the box smoothly running. To switch to nVidia on the fly, I have to literally PULL the Radeon stuff in toto, roll the bock temporarily to BASE video settings, revert DriectX to a stock Microsoft DirectX, then install the nVidia stuff. So what happened makes experiential sense. That conflict will do what happened to you, BIG TIME.
John.
The nVidia drivers went in typically one to two times allowing for revisions, the Radeons I typically ended up grabbing three to four revisions for each card to get the core drivers to sync with Microsoft DirectX well. Over FIVE Windows main release versions starting with 95. When 3.1 and 3.11 were out and in common use, Trident and others than ATI and Nvidia were king of video hardware for most boxes. Before that, the companies that made the video cards that worked best given the other hardware with Microsoft stuff were Trident and some totally dead firms.
Microsoft favors nVidia LONG TERM, ATI less so. And ATI is less likely to sync with Microsoft, because they get the info later than nVidia does. So,their 3D syncs less with Microsoft DirectX. Possibly this trend is reversing, you have used much more recent Radeons than I. Also, I have the perception that ATI is less fine detail oriented, Nvidia also more detail oriented as well as starting their software dev earlier and ATI later in hardware dev research and testing. After quite a while, I phase long term into the equation which might not make sense here too much to folks much younger, but tends to yeild better overall boxes in longer term. This is why I mostly get PROBLEM boxes to work on, BIG PROBLEM boxes more often than small problem boxes and COMPLEX problem boxes versus single issue boxes. This makes me say things that over the shorter term seem not to make fiscal sense but are likely to work longer term. I also work with more than just Widnwos boxes, and for about 2\3 of the non-Windows boxes nVidia has drivers and ATI has broken or incompletely functional drivers-- this is immediate issue and short term less relevant, but longer term much more so, as it is atrend which I will admit ATI si TRYING to reverse some, but OH SO SLOWLY over the last 8 years. SIS Chipsets like Radeon better than nVidia overall but their QC is poorer than other major chipset makers.
Guess what I have been trying to show is the interrelation between hardware and software sets, and the intererelation between driver addon packs and O\Ss themselves, adn I natively use a longer term perspective after three plus decades of looking at, fixing, and understanding boxes. Started with programming a CLOSET sized thing, then PRIME minicomputers, then remote to mainframes and local with pre-PS\1s and Ps1s, then Atari ST and TTs, then 386's, 486's and then Pentia starting with the plain Pentium and AMD K series (most of it) with hundreds of video cards and embedded chipsets involved (I stopped counting). That is why I have this perspective on things.
This is NOT a RANT at all, nor did I take offense, nor is this boasting nor attention-getting, this is explication of my BIAS toward longer term trends influencing my overall system building as much as short term stuff, cuz much of the short term stuff turns out to be hype over the long run. Also my BIAS to explaining how clock works reliably over longer term rather than fine focusing on one obvious thing set which often is a symptom of something possibly related but in a broader sense.
Right now Radeon is popular because ATI si throwing work at it to tilt the competitive tables some, but long-term ATI has put lees R&D into software than has nVidia and less money into software than nVidia, and less overall compatibility testing into nVidia. Hopefully, from what you say, ATI has been working lately more toward intercompatibility, but what I have seen long-term is more betas than final stuff, and that means more rework attempts but less polishing of real fine details. It is good that we counterbalance each other in this way, I think, for the whole forum. You have convinced me to try more AMD and nforce stuff than I have in past after issues with many K6 and K7 chips and earlier processors in a day when Microsft favored Intel even more than it now does.
John.