imm - Replacing Dell Power supply

imm

Hi,

I have a Dell 531 as well and immediately upgraded the stock 1 gig total to 2 gig total. However, I went with Corsair Value RAM 5300's. I noticed a nice increase in bandwidth using memtest, I'd be curious what you're getting with the 6400 sticks if you don't mind running it?

As for the power supply, the connector is definitely not what I would call standard. I bought an Antec Basiq 500 Watt model to replace mine so I could use an 8800gt card and the pinouts are like a mirror image. The supply works fine for my Asus A7N8X DX board, so I'd be curious why the Dell is different or are there multiple ATX specs?

DellCA

The difference I can think of is the fact Dell normally uses BTX motherboards. The only problem with that idea is that the documentation lists the power connections as ATX. I'll look into it and see what I can find.


Larry
Dell Customer Advocate

DellCA

From what I can find out, the 531 should use the industry standard ATX power connections. Nothing I can find indicates otherwise.

This may seem like a silly suggestion, but it has bit me in the past (and I felt pretty silly when i realized the mistake): Are you sure you didn't have the 20+4 power connector backwards when you tried to connect it?

Larry
Dell Customer Advocate

imm

Quite sure!

DellCA

I figured as much, but wanted to double check. I've learned the hard way (more than once) to always check the "simple" stuff when troubleshooting computers. I've lost count of how many times "Is it plugged in? Is it turned on?" as resolved the problem.

Are you able to take a picture of the power connector on the motherboard? If you can do so, with the connector from that power supply, that would help me in figuring out why an ATX12v connection isn't working with the system. From the research I've done, we have actually stopped using BTX boards and gone to ATX. That and everything I have read about the system and the power supply you purchased tell me it should work.

The only thing other than having the connector backwards I can think of is that the different flavors of ATX power supplies use slightly different pinouts. The Antec site lists different specification versions for some of the different PSUs.

While I'm waiting to hear back from you I'll see if I can get in touch with someone on our engineering side that would know for sure which ATX specification our PSUs are using.

Larry
Dell Customer Advocate

imm

FWIW: this is the power supply I'm trying to use:

http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=23500


http://www.newegg.com/Product/ShowImage.aspx?CurImage=17-371-004-06.jpg&Image=17-371-004-02.jpg%2c17-371-004-03.jpg%2c17-371-004-04.jpg%2c17-371-004-05.jpg%2c17-371-004-06.jpg%2c17-371-004-07.jpg%2c17-371-004-08.jpg%2c17-371-004-09.jpg&S7ImageFlag=0&Depa=0&Description=Antec+Basiq+BP500U+500W+Power+Supply

HW_Hack

As one of the R+D geeks who was responsible for the new BTX spec (not the formal spec but the research/data pointing to the benefits of such a form factor) I know the the basic BTX spec would automatically adopt and use the ATX power connector(s). It would be loony-toons to create a new form factor and use a new power connector - thus forcing the PC industry to re-tool or create new tooling - costing millions of dollars etc.

I would also be surprised (although its possible for special circumstances) for Dell to not use the standard BTX ( ATX) power connector ... as this would drive more cost into the base product (i.e. forcing use of a non standard power supply). Now before y'all jump on that statement -- yes there were many custom solutions used in PCs well into the '90s - but industry standards and cost issues have all but eliminated this in most PCs.

So my bet is either you've got some type of specialized power supply - or something simple as was mentioned by the Dell guy - meaning you've got something backwards - etc. Also looking at the links you provided I can see that the main PS plug has an optional power conn (part of the ATX spec) attached to it. Look closely at the PS connector and you'll see that one end can be slid up and off - that may fix your issue

http://www.antec.com/connectors.php?ProdID=23500&SetZone=en

HW_Hack

Also for all your industry spec needs go to

http://www.formfactors.org/default.asp :bigggrin:

DellCA

Yeah, the information I've gotten so far shows that we have been using the standard ATX power connections, even on the BTX systems, for a while now (yes, we learned from using the proprietary connection in the past ).

Right now I'm waiting for a confirmation on what version of the ATX12V standard the Inspiron 531 is using.

Larry
Dell Customer Advocate

Thrax

I just wanted to say that it's really great to have a representative from Dell around our forums. We appreciate your presence.

imm

Here's some pics...I see there's a different amount of pins, thanks guys! Just shows to go you, trust your eyes more than your brain So is this as simple as putting those two pieces together (20+4) and plugging it into the Dell?

HW_Hack

imm wrote:

Here's some pics...I see there's a different amount of pins, thanks guys! Just shows to go you, trust your eyes more than your brain So is this as simple as putting those two pieces together (20+4) and plugging it into the Dell?

Yes it should be that easy --- the MB connector is keyed on both ends with special shaped pins ---- as long as the pin-keying matches you are good to go. Many times the additional pins are made to snap or slide (mate) into the main connector

imm

Great, thanks! What threw me here is that the Asus MB from my other machine (A7N8X) says "ATX" on the connector, I wasn't aware there was an ATX 20 pin and an ATX 4 pin (it doesn't use that 4 pin connector).

DellCA

imm wrote:

Here's some pics...I see there's a different amount of pins, thanks guys! Just shows to go you, trust your eyes more than your brain So is this as simple as putting those two pieces together (20+4) and plugging it into the Dell?

I double checked the board diagram (I really wish I had one of these systems to look at) and it shows a 4 pin ATX_CPU power connector near the processor (other side from the memory) and the 24 pin ATX_PWR connection between the memory and the edge of the board. When you check the connectors on the Antec Basiq 500 you will see there is a 4-pin 12v (ATX_CPU) connector, and a 20+4 pin (ATX_PWR) connector. The 20+4 pin connector is because some boards only use 20 pins for ATX_PWR, while others use 24, and Antec makes their PSUs so they work with either (one of the things I like about them).

On the 20+4 pin connector the 4 should only fit on one end. What probably works best if you are not sure which end is to connect the 20 pin plug to the motherboard first, as it only fits one way, then add the 4 pin connector into the space that is left.

Let us know if this fixes things.

Larry
Dell Customer Advocate

Finstigator

Hey guys-
I'm new to this forum - I found my way here as I was trying to find out info on my Dell Inspiron 531 and it seems like I found the right place. I was going to replace my power supply also and was thinking about the Antec True power trio 550 watt but wasn't sure it would fit in my case. After reading some of Larry's replies, it seems like it should. The other question is, my motherboard is an m2n61-ax with an athlon 64 x2 4000. I wanted to upgrade to the 64 x2 5600 and was wondering if it would support it. I looked on the ASUS site but couldn't find that model. I was going to order the PS and the processor from newegg but wanted to make sure they were compatible before I ordered. Thanks

Leonardo

Your selected PSU should work just fine your motherboard and processor.

GHoosdum

Just to confirm, I connected an Antec Earthwatts 500 to my machine the other day and it booted and ran just fine. The motherboard does indeed use a standard 20+4 pin main connector as Larry says.

Actually, case clearance is something of a problem. The PSU that comes in the Inspiron 531 has cabling that is sized to fit exactly in the configuration in which the machine is built. The longer cables of other power supply units have the potential to cramp the tiny case and decrease airflow. I'd actually recommend that you relocate the optical drive to the lower of the two slots and use the space vacated at the top to fit in the extra cabling.

Finstigator, I know that the machine can support an X2 5000+ CPU since that is what is is my model of Inspiron 531, but I'm not certain about the 5600+. The 5600+ operates at higher wattage and temperature than the 4800+ and 5000+ so I'd hesitate to install it in this case - it's rather cramped and the airflow is far from optimal.

Leonardo

it's rather cramped and the airflow is far from optimal.

Aha! Time to take out the saw, files, grinding wheel, and drill! (evil laugh in the background)

Finstigator

Thanks for the feedback guys. I found another guy on a different forum on overclocking and he had the same mobo with a 64 x2 5600 so I should be okay with that also.

Leonardo

I hope all goes well for you.

Finstigator

Thanks, I will update you after I receive everything and put it in. If I don't talk to you guys before Tuesday, have a safe and happy New Years Eve/Day!

Finstigator

Hey guys, I put in the Antec truepower trio 650 watt ps along with the AMD 64 x2 5600 cpu and the geforce 8600 gt xxx and my dell is much better now. The power supply was tight but I got all the cables to fit. It runs a little hotter than I expected although the processor is an 89w compared to the 65w it replaced. Do you guys think artic 5 silver would make any difference compared to the thermal compound that came with the cpu?

Leonardo

Yes. MX-2, TX-2, or Arctic Silver 5 would indeed make a big difference over the barely adequate junk the manufacturers.

EDIT: Please make sure you apply the thermal paste correctly, or you may not experience any improvement, or worse, actually increase the CPU temperature.

imm

How about that fan noise from the 8600 GT XXX eh? Whoooo doggy that things loud.

GHoosdum

When it hits full speed it sounds like someone is using a hair dryer.