Q9450 Board

Qeldroma

I'm thinking about getting a Q9450 soon. What motherboard would would you get for it today? Memory & PSU recomendations are welcomed as well- I'm personally still leaning to DDR2 but ... is DDR3 well enough along to be worth it?

Please feel free to put down your $$$ dream board, but I'm really interested in something that is in the $150 ballpark. Dual video card boards don't interest me and I don't want to hurt the cooling bill any more by overclocking the snot out of it- so the board should be able to overclock, but I don't care to push it far.

Thanks for any input.

mmonnin

Do you want to go 500+mhz FSB OC or like a 400-450mhz FSB OC? FSB isnt always the best way to go for performance. Getting a low tRD and strap will keep the memory latency low.

If you want 4GHz getting a board that can do closer to 500mhz and over will be needed.

Qeldroma

mmonnin wrote:

If you want 4GHz getting a board that can do closer to 500mhz and over will be needed.

Thanks for the response-

I'd actually be glad if it got over 3. Overclocking it that far is not necessary- and actually undesireable in my situation. Heat generation is the enemy- especially in the summer when I can spend more pennies on cooling a CPU than I do on powering it- so I'd prefer a lower TDP. I'd like it if my 45nm quad would run cooler than my X2 so I could leave it on to fold.

Also, high-end gaming considerations are unnecessary- so things like SLI & Crossfire are nice but not necessary if it's a cost issue. I'm hoping for a more efficient solution than a premier board.

mmonnin

Well 4Ghz on air seems to be easy on the processor side of things, they just have low multipliers so a higher FSB is needed, thats all.

A Q9450 could probably do 3GHz undervolted...the thermal package is at 130W but I dont think it comes anywhere near that at stock.

There is no doubt that any 45nm CPU from Intel will be more productive per watt than any X2.

Qeldroma

I'm going to try and get this in before my next adventure so here is what I'm thinking for the Q9450 Build:

Boards I'm considering:

1. MSI P35 Platinum Combo

2. GIGABYTE GA-EP35C-DS3R

3. ASUS P5K-E/WIFI-AP

I'm kind of hung up on P35- it looks like X38s are too pricey right now.

Also:

Antec EA500 Power Supply

OCZ Reaper HPC 4GB 1066 DDR2(2 x 2GB)

Corsair Dominator 4GB(2 x 2GB) 1066 DDR2 (Do I really need the fans?)

This machine is basically replacing a long-in-the-tooth AMD that is a no-show in folding anymore- so this is a huge step there. I have most everything else but ...

Comments appreciated and any sub-$300 video card recommendations welcomed. Thanks .

mmonnin

Unless you want SLI there is no real reason to get anything besides a P35 board, or if you are an overclock junkie. And if you arent going to push the system to the max then about any P35 board will do, just get one with a good rep and the features you want and of course whats in the price range.

The onboard Wifi is pretty nice, I wish I had that on all(any) of my boards.

broady81

Sub $300 GFx I would say ATi 3870 (depending on how cheap they over your side of the pond). 8800GTS is nice too. You'd have change left over aswell looking at Newegg.com

Qeldroma

Hey thanks mm & Broady. The 3870s ARE a good deal and some are tuned to save power. This one has caught my eye:

SAPPHIRE 100225TXSR Radeon HD 3870 512MB 256-bit

And yeah, P35 is the poor man's way to "nearly" high end and I'm waffling between the ASUS and Gig- unless there is a better idea. I'm not, however, a big fan of wireless yet- it's still pretty flakey and slow- though it would clean up the wiring some. But like you- I like the idea.

Again- thanks.

mmonnin

I could have used the wireless to spread the heat around the apt this winter from the multiple computers. Wireless doesnt need to be fast for FAH.

I have the abit IP35-E and I think Leo has 2. Its been good to me. The Asus and Giga have quite a few more bells and whistles on some of their boards.

Qeldroma

Oh yeah- that reminds me that this is also not a folding-only rig. For that matter, all my folding rigs are personal use machines- so a "barebones" option somewhere down the road can have too many limitations. However, this Abit board

ABIT IP35 Pro

was an option I hadn't considered. Its only ding is there is no DDR3 support- something I may never take advantage of anyhow. The user feedback is pretty good too.

Thanks, mm.

mmonnin

Thats not exactly the same one I mentioned, it has the -E on it and can be found for $70 at times. The one you linked is more along the lines of the other 2 mentioned above.

For now DD3 is too pricey. For most of us I bet we would upgrade to a Nehalem platform for that at least.

Qeldroma

Well, I'm gathering up stuff for this Q9450 build though I still have not ordered the mobo, CPU and memory yet ... ya know, the minor details . I decided to make this my replacement rig, so I've sweetened the deal some. I've installed and checked out everything I have to date which is:

Antec 650W Earthwatts PSU

I think for quiet, efficiency, price and my personal experience with their units, this was a smokin' deal. It's more than I'll likely need, but I'll be long and not short for just about anything I want to do with this build.

WD 640GB Hard Drive

I replaced my WD 400GB unit (going to the wife) with this one, but I can actually feel a difference in my video work. The 400 was starting to fill up and had to manage it a bunch so this was a welcome relief.

Diamond Viper 3870 video card with VIVO

While I know there are better units available, this was my most pleasant surprise of the bunch so far. This is probably the least I've paid for a video card in 5+ years (Yay competition!).

However, I was a bit daunted when I opened the box. I'm not used to having a board so large. To give example, check this out:



The 3870 (left) is stacked up with the X1900AIW I replaced. The HSF is the dominant factor and it makes the AIWs' blush. What made me choose this particular 3870 was its VIVO capability- this is the only 3870 I know of that has it (I'm just one of a few who actually uses it).

I was afraid I was going to increase my power draw by quite a bit with this unit (understand that the X1900AIW was about as efficient as it got for X19xx boards). But here was my best surprise.

I dug out my watts up? power meter and did a few measurements of my cabinet. Here are the key results (the system is number 3. "Jerry" in my sig):

System on, CPU idle @ login screen:

with X1900AIW: 133 Watts
with HD3870: 133 Watts

System on, logged in, Folding@Home running:

with X1900AIW: ~195 Watts
with HD3870: ~180 Watts

System running with F@H, Crysis @ 1280x960 Medium WinXP:

with X1900AIW: ~244 Watts
with HD3870: ~230 Watts

My picture and response were definitely better. I've been able to crank up my settings quite a bit in Crysis.

Btw, I'm seriously considering 64-bit Vista as the OS of the final product.

More to come .

Qeldroma

A bit of an update-

There is a supply shortage of reasonably priced Q9450s, so I'm pretty well stalled. I wouldn't bother mentioning it except that this shortage is so severe that Newegg deactivated its sale a few days ago. This usually doesn't happen at Newegg unless the product is discontinued but my understanding is that, in this case, they have not been able to restock for too long. The shortage is pretty much across the board. I find this fairly unusual for Intel and its huge production capacity. Maybe they're having difficulties with carrying so many lines of CPUs?

While I'm sure there will be more soon, it looks like the $1000+ 12MB cache Yorkfields rule that market. I'm a little afraid that the demand may inflate the price of Q9450s to what I'm not willing to pay .

_k

If you live close to Tempe or Phoenix AZ hit up a Fry's Electronics I know my store just got a bunch in besides the first shipment, 1, and the price is still 339 for a retail boxed not an OEM. That price was 10 dollars cheaper than the price on newegg before they pulled them after everyone did the price hike. I don't know if those stores actually have any in stock cause i am at home right now but i can post back up with an update saturday night or you can just call them.
Tempe [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,](602) 445-5110 :for the electronic components podium
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,](602) 445-5149 :for the e-cage where they proc is held
Phoenix [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,](602) 445-8810: "" ""
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica,](602) 445-8849: "" ""
[/FONT]Item #[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica] 5539940 that is the part number you are looking for...currently sold out on the website same price in store.....for texas that is i cannot say for other states.[/FONT]

Qeldroma

I really had to take a deep breath before responding to this. I will write it down trying to be respectful, but many times the truth just isn't.

Sorry, you can't tempt me with hardware from Fry's. I have had enough of floor service incompetence, defective parts and screwed up returns with this outfit. I will pay the extra for better service if I have to and just about the only things I get there anymore are software and games on sale- something I can at least go get the fixes for somewhere else.

Others may have had better experiences, but I and others I know are among those who haven't

Leonardo

Why don't you just get another Q6600 and be done with it? The Q9450 is not going to be appreciably faster. The power requirements will be less with a Q9, but not that much less. You can find Q6600s all over the place now for $220 retail, even less on trading forums and eBay. In my book, a Q6600 at $200 or less just walks all over a Q9 at $300+. And if you were still burning for a Q9450 a few months from now, your Q6600 on trading forums would still bring a respectable price.

Thrax

Probably because you'll get an extra gigahertz out of the Q9.

Leonardo

Probably because you'll get an extra gigahertz out of the Q9.

4.5-4.8GHz? What? Maybe I'm just not quite up to date.

Thrax

Easily 4+. The good chips are doing 4.2-4.6 on air.

Qeldroma

Thanks all.

_k_- I don't think you were trying sell Fry's warez but advise me of an availability option- so thanks and just know it's more me than you.

Thanks too Leo- yeah the Q6600 is definitely the bargain quad. I'm waiting for the Q9450 mainly to get my hands on the latest proc. I will probably look for the same "bargain" proc in a Shanghai or Nahelem when they come out as well. Call it a fancy at work here despite your sound advice.

Dang, Thrax- is there a stepping to watch for? A setting? That's just impressive. Thanks for the heads ... now to fish for a link or two unless you got one- .

Thrax

The Yorkfields only have one stepping right now. It's luck of the draw.

_k

word qeldroma. All i can see with the x and the q 9450 cores is they are peaking at a 478 bus from the proc. the boards are doing the 8400s' up around and over 510. So the current steppings that you can find are not insane but enough for most.

Leonardo

Easily 4+. The good chips are doing 4.2-4.6 on air.

I stand corrected, Sir Thrax. I've been so heavily into upgrading with used (cheap) Q6600 associated builds that I haven't watch the 45nm goodies very closely.

Qeldroma

Yeah. I had heard that the Q9450 is a difficult high OCer and that the invisible line is right around 3.6GHz (450). That and the fact that not a lot of low end mobos have high FSB capability. I'm thinking that a 4+ OC is more the exception than the rule- but it looks like it's out there.

However, except for simply trying it, I'm not an agressive overclocker and I likely won't have a mobo that will push that high anyhow. I'll back off to save on power and reduce heat exhaust (saving additional cooling power this time of year)- so I'm easy to please in that regard. I'll likely Fold this one 24/7, so those savings are pretty significant.

Btw- I just got my power statement- the first since we backed off OCing and gone to partial shutdowns of Folding systems for the hot season- a decent reduction from last year (I'll get more analytical with more results). If I figure it right, the power savings from these measures and the upgrade to more efficient systems may actually pay for this proc. Will let you know....

jkohm

Qeldroma wrote:

Diamond Viper 3870 video card with VIVO

While I know there are better units available, this was my most pleasant surprise of the bunch so far. This is probably the least I've paid for a video card in 5+ years (Yay competition!).

.

Does this video card vent out the back instead of inside the case?

Qeldroma

It does. It has a good airflow for a video card (pushing about 40 CFM). However, if you couple that with a good CPU HSF pushing 60-80 CFM plus a PSU with a good exhaust, I could see you having some backwash if your case isn't well ventilated.

Funny that you brought it up- my case is touchy now as I filter the inlets and I currently have to pop the door to prevent this. I'm thinking of and carousing for a case mod or two that should help.

jkohm

Qeldroma wrote:

It does. It has a good airflow for a video card (pushing about 40 CFM). However, if you couple that with a good CPU HSF pushing 60-80 CFM plus a PSU with a good exhaust, I could see you having some backwash if your case isn't well ventilated.

Funny that you brought it up- my case is touchy now as I filter the inlets and I currently have to pop the door to prevent this. I'm thinking of and carousing for a case mod or two that should help.

I don't understand what and how you are filtering?

Qeldroma

I cover my main inlets with Swiffers- fans and vents. I live in a dusty environment and what they catch in just a couple of weeks is amazing. However, it restricts the flow of air into the case and it's not keeping up with the amount of exhaust the fans want to push out. I'm at work- may provide pics l8r.

jkohm

Thanks. I'm seriously considering the Viper and also have Lots of dust. I don't understand how the VIVO is used but feel it doesn't cost much to have and I may find a use for it someday.

Qeldroma

jkohm wrote:

.... I don't understand how the VIVO is used but feel it doesn't cost much to have and I may find a use for it someday.

VIVO is used to handle old analog TV, VCR, etc. signals. This is generally done by an S-Video or proprietary jack on the card and generally the cards come with connection adapters for composite video, etc. I mainly use it for capturing and digitizing VCR tapes.