LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
Thanks for caring, guys! (sniff, sniff)
I have one SMP client running under Ubuntu 8.04 LTS/VMware Player 2.5. It's cranking away perfectly last night, so I stopped it set up a second SMP client. To do that required upgrading the package's image from 7.10 to 8.04. Somehow that bombed this morning when I arose and restarted the files installations/upgrades. So right now I'm in the middle of re-upgrading the second VMware/Linux image to 8.05. (That's pretty big download for DSL, and we have download cap. Wife is gonna love me.)
I let the successful client run long enough to get a fix on production, Which was 3072PPD Folding a 2669/2/126/52. Not really impressed, I can get that sometimes on Windows with 2653 work unit.
Sorry to get this info out to you so late today guys, but being a Linux noob, I was up VERY late...this morning working out some issues. Learning new groofy terminology, ctrl-alt and ctrl-g to shift between VM and Windows desktop, absolutely awful desktop scaling with VMware/Ubuntu. my head hurts
OK, let me release this post for you to chew on, then I'll prepare another outlining monitoring problems.
I let the successful client run long enough to get a fix on production, Which was 3072PPD Folding a 2669/2/126/52. Not really impressed, I can get that sometimes on Windows with 2653 work unit.
.
Right, but this is with only two of the four cores being utilized, correct?
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
Monitoring. I cannot get Ubuntu to share directories/files on the home network therefor I am unable to monitor Folding through FAHMon on another computer. I have manually open the FahLog file in Home\Ubuntu to check Folding status.
These are the instructions I used in attempt to share an Ubuntu file on the network: towares the middle of the page, "Using FahMon in Windows to monitor your Linux"
I followed the instructions exactly - I think so, at least, including the Samba password command in the terminal. After clicking the FAH folder's "share this folder," I then clicked on the "Create Share" button. The the "Share Name" box turned red and there was this message in the window,"'net' usershare' returned erro 255:net usershare: cannot open usershare directory /var/lib/samba/usershares.Error Permission denied. You do not have permission to create a usershare. Ask your administrator to grant you permissions to create a share."
Ubunto does show up in the Microsoft Windows Network. Clicking on the + sign only reveals "Printers and Faxes."
Update: I did an internet search and found a "net usershare" command. Running that in the terminal: "cannot open usershare directory /var/lib/samba/usershares. Error. Permission denied. You do not have permission to create a userhsare. Ask your administrator to grant you permissions to create a share."
The system with which I'm testing also runs 2 X GPU FAH clients. Running on four CPU cores (Q6600), the Linux SMP unit cut production on both GPU units by 30% or more. I had assign affinity to the VMware process to only two cores. Once I did that, GPU production returned to normal. I don't understand that, because I'm running Nvidia drivers 180.60. GPU processing is done about 99% on the GPU core, not the CPU. Although two CPU cores are almost unengaged, according Task Manager and SpeedFan, if I shift SMP to four cores, GPU production plummets. This just makes no sense to me.
I never did get VMware Server 2.0 to start. It could not get the web browser, FirePuppy or Internet Exploder to connect to the host....or whatever it's supposed to connect for startup. Spent two hours on just trying to connect - network permissions, ports permissions, and a whole bunch of ugly so forth. But that's irrelevant for the moment, as I'm now using VMware Player 2.5, which is working as well as it can, I guess.
Sorry, I know that's a lot to read.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
Right, but this is with only two of the four cores being utilized, correct?
Yes, I did not calculate production with four cores (probably should have), because it was just destroying the GPUs production.
So that means you are getting the same production out of two cores under Linux as you get with four under Windows, I'd be impressed.
You will not be able to allow one VMWare macjine to use more than two cores, hence the dual VM setup. I'm not sure why it would kill your GPU production. I'll think some more about it when I'm not on the mobile.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
So that means you are getting the same production out of two cores under Linux as you get with four under Windows, I'd be impressed.
In that respect, yes, I'm also impressed. I really need to be able to monitor the unit without opening the individual files. It may seem like a mere inconvenience, but considering the number of clients running in this farm, I need a quick glass with all clients represented on one page - FAHMon.
But still, same production on two cores versus four cores is still only the same production. We'll see what production there is with 2 X Linux SMP + 2 X Windows GPU. That will be the decision point as to whether to continue with this.
You will not be able to allow one VMWare macjine to use more than two cores, hence the dual VM setup. I'm not sure why it would kill your GPU production.
Task Manager/Processes does not show which VMware process - several shown - is actually the Linux SMP. One of the those VMware processes though, was running on all four CPU cores. I changed the affinity to two cores, then only two cores were processing and GPU production shot back up.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
$$#%# - all the text just dissappeared in my the Ubuntu updating window. Running blind now. Is there a way to refresh a Linux window?
Update: Second Ubuntu machine installation/upgrading has imploded. I did a ctr-alt-del to check Task Manager but forgot first toggle the ever cute ctl-alt to be on the Windows screen. The Ubuntu installation burped and died. Well, there went another two hours lost.
It's time to cut losses and withdraw. I' not putting any more time into this particular configuarion. I think I'll download an older version of VMware server and give that other VMware machine image a try again.
LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
Because I don't want a new time consuming hobby - Linux. Also, I don't want to go find tons of hardware to replace Windows-compatible hardware that runs very, very well. I have no need for a new OS - Vista, OSX, Linux, whatever. XP runs very smoothly for me. The only reason I'm playing with virtual machines/Linux right now is to experiment, learn, and to try and squeeze more performance out of Folding@Home.
I think you overestimate the time commitment and compatibility problems, but I can understand not wanting to chance it.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
Alright, I've got progress to report:
I am now running Linux SMP in Xubuntu 8.04 64-bit in a virtual machine, under VMware 1.0.2. I had some coding problems at first, as the guides I found were a little outdated. Hey, I'm learning! It was actually very simple code, but not necessarily for me.
Issues:
1. Cannot figure out to get two CPU cores running. It download and successfully run a Linux SMP code, but it is only running on one core. I set the affinity for VMware to multi-core, but SMP Linux is just on one core.
With a previous VM I had to edit a .vmx file by adding "numvcpus = "2"." I don't know how to do it with this.
2. In Ubuntu, how do I turn off a running application?
Before you start your VM, you should have an option for settings, unless I'm thinking VMWare Workstation; somewhere in the settings for the actual machine, you should be able to tell it number of cores.
How you kill an app depends on how it's running. Are we talking about a terminal-based app like SMP, or a GUI app? There's a task manager just like in Windows under the administrative menus from where you can kill both; if you want to stop SMP from running, I'm pretty sure it's just ctrl-C, just like in the Win cmd prompt.
There are also various kill commands you can run in terminal, but that's probably more than you need.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
Settings in the VMware console show it is set for 2 processors. Maybe I did the code wrong and installed uniprocessor? But when Folding started, I thought I saw the -SMP flag? Hmm. I'll uninstall Folding and try and reinstall.
Does this code look good? It's what I used last time.
LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
I tried to redo it, here's what I did and the results:
I manually deleted everything FAH I could find, re-entered the code in terminal, configured the client, and restarted it. It's now running a uniprocessor client, again.
Here is what is working correctly:
VMWare Server 1.0.2 and the VMware console
Xubuntu 8.04
Here is what is not working:
SMP Linux Folding.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
Alright, I edited the shortcut with the flags, but it STILL won't work. Here's the what I did:
Now press 'Ctrl+X', then 'Y' to save, 'Enter' to exit.
Now type
[code:1:00de93bac0]chmod +x startfah[/code:1:00de93bac0]
Now to start the client type ./startfah into the terminal.
I checked the edit in Places. It was in the correct location and it was properly edited. I tried to start the client in terminal with "./startfah" and I got YOU DO NOT HAVE PERMISSION. I tried starting via a Launch - terminal mode. The terminal opens and there is a cursor, that's all. It does not start.
HUH? what? this is nonsense - why is it so damned difficult?
Its really easy to setup, you dont have to bother installing linux nor setting up Samba (to monitor with Fahmon) its everything already configured.
The image has DHCP enabled (using VMware's NAT option) but I changed them to static so I know which IP goes to which client. If you dont mind this, its just as easy as starting up the VM, running config, rebooting and you start folding.
Just fyi, I use Windows 2003 server as host, VMware workstation 6.5 (just personal preference, WMware server also works) and on a 3Ghz Q66, with 2 A2s WUs, I get 5200PPD (2600 each).
Let me know if I can help you setting them up!
Nex.-
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
I've run out of vacation days. I'm back to work today (aarrrggghhh). I'm still willing to try another version. I really liked Xubuntu 8.04, but I became 'very angry' (a la Marvin the Martian) when after spending three hours to get the coding right, I hit enter and..."You do not have permission." A computer almost when throught the -20F window.
Nexus, thanks for the link. I had not seen that solution(?) yet, but I will try it.
Were you able to share the Folding directories with Windows FahMon?
3Ghz Q66, with 2 A2s WUs, I get 5200PPD (2600 each)
Does that system have any GPU2 Folding clients running. One of the VMware/Ubuntu configs I tried (actually had it working well!) really cut down the Windows GPU2 clients' production.
Yes, the Fah folder is shared by default and can be accessed by using \\(your VM´s IP)\folding
Yes, I do have one GPU2 client on a dedicated q66, and like you said, it does cot down its production. I have tried setting the GPU2 client with high priority and all cores assigned, but still, when there is a VM using the last core, the GPU2 takes a hit.
I tried both on Win2k3 and Vista SP1.
That 5200PPD was on a dedicated Q66 with no GPU2 client.
And regarding power consumption, a 3ghz quad with 2 SMP VM's, takes 190w, while a 2.4ghz quad with 1 SMP VM and 1 GPU2 client (leaving 1 core unused) uses 214w aprox (with a 8800GT 256mb). but it does 5000-8000PPD depending on the WU assigned.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
Fah folder is shared by default
Good, then I won't have Linux telling me I don't have sharing privileges, even when I set the username and password. (arrogant little OS!...or newbie user error)
It appears to me that SMP Folding via Linux may only be an advantage over Windows if there are no GPU clients running simultaneously. When I did have SMP/VMware/Linux running successfully a few days ago, the total production of GPU2 + SMP was about the same as all of it running under windows.
yes you are correct, its best for gpuless configurations. I thought the low CPU overhead with the latests CUDA/nvidia drivers were low enough to have them all together, but so far it hasnt work out for me.
But well, if you want to try an easy linux distro with VMware, this is as easy as it gets.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
I thought the low CPU overhead with the latests CUDA/nvidia drivers were low enough to have them all together
Yeah, that was my assumption, too! Pity. 180.60 works so well in Windows. Regardless of the misleading marketing and manufacturing process probems from Nvidia, they've got a knockout drivers development team.
But well, if you want to try an easy linux distro with VMware, this is as easy as it gets.
I really like the sound of that!
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
I use Windows 2003 server as host, VMware workstation 6.5 (just personal preference, WMware server also works)
I've used VMware Server and VMware Player. What is VM Workstation? What differentiates it from Player and Server?
Fah folder is shared by default and can be accessed by using \\(your VM´s IP)\folding
Will I then need to assign static IPs? I've run into brick walls before by Linux permissions - which I never figured out. Does the configuration you recommend rely on on Windows user permissions? Sorry about the imprecise questions and nitpicking, but I'm battle fatigued from previous Linux/VM engagements.
WM workstation is another product from Vmware, its similar to VMware server but this one is licensed and have some extra bells and wissels.
You dont need static IPs, as long as you know the VM ip address (with the ifconfig command), you dont have to set any permissions to open the share folder, its completely permission free.
But if you want to have lots of these VMs running 24/7, I would suggest going the static route. In that case I will help you out doing the necessary changes.
I´ve also found a way to have each VM start with the assigned specific cores in a quad cpu (VM1 to cores 0,1 and VM2 to 2&3), so you dont have to mess around with affinity settings or programs each time you start the VM. This is not documented in the OCN guide though.
Did you read the guide, do you have any questions as to how setting it up?
These are the key commands to have in hand with this distro:
screen -r after starting the VM up and loging in (user: ocn pass: overclock) opens up the client status control C like in Windows, this stops the SMP client ifconfig to know the VM IP address ls to list the files in the root directory where all files are stored. rm to delete a file or lists of files.
Like it states in the guide, its best, the first time you start up the client, to Control C, and do a ./fah6 -configonly so you can get your user, team and rest of stuff configured, once done, you can either reboot (so it will start again automatically) or do it manually with ./fah6 -smp -verbosity 9
Good luck!
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited January 2009
you dont have to set any permissions to open the share folder, its completely permission free.
Are you referring to VM or the Linux version recommended in the link?
But if you want to have lots of these VMs running 24/7, I would suggest going the static route. In that case I will help you out doing the necessary changes.
OH, not to worry, it will be a while be for I get that far! I have to first to get just one client running and monitored. You know, walk before I run! I may be an old hand with Folding, but not Folding in Linux!
Did you read the guide, do you have any questions as to how setting it up?
I've skimmed through it. It will probably be this weekend before I can get to it. If it's warm enough (yes, warm enough), my son and I will be skiing, so I might not do any Folding/VM/Linux training this weekend. Rest assured though, I will call on you, mas0n, and Snarkopod when I get stuck.
Thanks to all of you for your help so far. It's been painful, but I've learned a lot.
Comments
I have one SMP client running under Ubuntu 8.04 LTS/VMware Player 2.5. It's cranking away perfectly last night, so I stopped it set up a second SMP client. To do that required upgrading the package's image from 7.10 to 8.04. Somehow that bombed this morning when I arose and restarted the files installations/upgrades. So right now I'm in the middle of re-upgrading the second VMware/Linux image to 8.05. (That's pretty big download for DSL, and we have download cap. Wife is gonna love me.)
I let the successful client run long enough to get a fix on production, Which was 3072PPD Folding a 2669/2/126/52. Not really impressed, I can get that sometimes on Windows with 2653 work unit.
Sorry to get this info out to you so late today guys, but being a Linux noob, I was up VERY late...this morning working out some issues. Learning new groofy terminology, ctrl-alt and ctrl-g to shift between VM and Windows desktop, absolutely awful desktop scaling with VMware/Ubuntu. my head hurts
OK, let me release this post for you to chew on, then I'll prepare another outlining monitoring problems.
Right, but this is with only two of the four cores being utilized, correct?
These are the instructions I used in attempt to share an Ubuntu file on the network: towares the middle of the page, "Using FahMon in Windows to monitor your Linux"
I followed the instructions exactly - I think so, at least, including the Samba password command in the terminal. After clicking the FAH folder's "share this folder," I then clicked on the "Create Share" button. The the "Share Name" box turned red and there was this message in the window,"'net' usershare' returned erro 255:net usershare: cannot open usershare directory /var/lib/samba/usershares.Error Permission denied. You do not have permission to create a usershare. Ask your administrator to grant you permissions to create a share."
Ubunto does show up in the Microsoft Windows Network. Clicking on the + sign only reveals "Printers and Faxes."
Update: I did an internet search and found a "net usershare" command. Running that in the terminal: "cannot open usershare directory /var/lib/samba/usershares. Error. Permission denied. You do not have permission to create a userhsare. Ask your administrator to grant you permissions to create a share."
The system with which I'm testing also runs 2 X GPU FAH clients. Running on four CPU cores (Q6600), the Linux SMP unit cut production on both GPU units by 30% or more. I had assign affinity to the VMware process to only two cores. Once I did that, GPU production returned to normal. I don't understand that, because I'm running Nvidia drivers 180.60. GPU processing is done about 99% on the GPU core, not the CPU. Although two CPU cores are almost unengaged, according Task Manager and SpeedFan, if I shift SMP to four cores, GPU production plummets. This just makes no sense to me.
I never did get VMware Server 2.0 to start. It could not get the web browser, FirePuppy or Internet Exploder to connect to the host....or whatever it's supposed to connect for startup. Spent two hours on just trying to connect - network permissions, ports permissions, and a whole bunch of ugly so forth. But that's irrelevant for the moment, as I'm now using VMware Player 2.5, which is working as well as it can, I guess.
Sorry, I know that's a lot to read.
You will not be able to allow one VMWare macjine to use more than two cores, hence the dual VM setup. I'm not sure why it would kill your GPU production. I'll think some more about it when I'm not on the mobile.
But still, same production on two cores versus four cores is still only the same production. We'll see what production there is with 2 X Linux SMP + 2 X Windows GPU. That will be the decision point as to whether to continue with this. Task Manager/Processes does not show which VMware process - several shown - is actually the Linux SMP. One of the those VMware processes though, was running on all four CPU cores. I changed the affinity to two cores, then only two cores were processing and GPU production shot back up.
Update: Second Ubuntu machine installation/upgrading has imploded. I did a ctr-alt-del to check Task Manager but forgot first toggle the ever cute ctl-alt to be on the Windows screen. The Ubuntu installation burped and died. Well, there went another two hours lost.
It's time to cut losses and withdraw. I' not putting any more time into this particular configuarion. I think I'll download an older version of VMware server and give that other VMware machine image a try again.
Native Linux - maybe in the future, but not now.
I am now running Linux SMP in Xubuntu 8.04 64-bit in a virtual machine, under VMware 1.0.2. I had some coding problems at first, as the guides I found were a little outdated. Hey, I'm learning! It was actually very simple code, but not necessarily for me.
Issues:
1. Cannot figure out to get two CPU cores running. It download and successfully run a Linux SMP code, but it is only running on one core. I set the affinity for VMware to multi-core, but SMP Linux is just on one core.
With a previous VM I had to edit a .vmx file by adding "numvcpus = "2"." I don't know how to do it with this.
2. In Ubuntu, how do I turn off a running application?
How you kill an app depends on how it's running. Are we talking about a terminal-based app like SMP, or a GUI app? There's a task manager just like in Windows under the administrative menus from where you can kill both; if you want to stop SMP from running, I'm pretty sure it's just ctrl-C, just like in the Win cmd prompt.
There are also various kill commands you can run in terminal, but that's probably more than you need.
Does this code look good? It's what I used last time.
sudo apt-get install ia32-libs && mkdir ~/Fah && cd ~/Fah && echo "cd ~/Fah && ./fah6 -smp -advmethods -forceasm -verbosity 9" >> startfah && chmod +x startfah && wget http://www.stanford.edu/group/pandegroup/folding/release/FAH6.02-Linux.tgz && tar xvf F* && ./fah6 -smp -configonly</pre>
I manually deleted everything FAH I could find, re-entered the code in terminal, configured the client, and restarted it. It's now running a uniprocessor client, again.
Here is what is working correctly:
VMWare Server 1.0.2 and the VMware console
Xubuntu 8.04
Here is what is not working:
SMP Linux Folding.
HUH? what? this is nonsense - why is it so damned difficult?
I´ve been using this Linux distro for folding under VMware on a Windows host for like a year now.
http://www.overclock.net/overclock-net-folding-home-team/296587-vmware-1-0-4-ubuntu-guide.html
Its really easy to setup, you dont have to bother installing linux nor setting up Samba (to monitor with Fahmon) its everything already configured.
The image has DHCP enabled (using VMware's NAT option) but I changed them to static so I know which IP goes to which client. If you dont mind this, its just as easy as starting up the VM, running config, rebooting and you start folding.
Just fyi, I use Windows 2003 server as host, VMware workstation 6.5 (just personal preference, WMware server also works) and on a 3Ghz Q66, with 2 A2s WUs, I get 5200PPD (2600 each).
Let me know if I can help you setting them up!
Nex.-
Nexus, thanks for the link. I had not seen that solution(?) yet, but I will try it.
Were you able to share the Folding directories with Windows FahMon? Does that system have any GPU2 Folding clients running. One of the VMware/Ubuntu configs I tried (actually had it working well!) really cut down the Windows GPU2 clients' production.
Yes, I do have one GPU2 client on a dedicated q66, and like you said, it does cot down its production. I have tried setting the GPU2 client with high priority and all cores assigned, but still, when there is a VM using the last core, the GPU2 takes a hit.
I tried both on Win2k3 and Vista SP1.
That 5200PPD was on a dedicated Q66 with no GPU2 client.
And regarding power consumption, a 3ghz quad with 2 SMP VM's, takes 190w, while a 2.4ghz quad with 1 SMP VM and 1 GPU2 client (leaving 1 core unused) uses 214w aprox (with a 8800GT 256mb). but it does 5000-8000PPD depending on the WU assigned.
It appears to me that SMP Folding via Linux may only be an advantage over Windows if there are no GPU clients running simultaneously. When I did have SMP/VMware/Linux running successfully a few days ago, the total production of GPU2 + SMP was about the same as all of it running under windows.
But well, if you want to try an easy linux distro with VMware, this is as easy as it gets.
I really like the sound of that!
You dont need static IPs, as long as you know the VM ip address (with the ifconfig command), you dont have to set any permissions to open the share folder, its completely permission free.
But if you want to have lots of these VMs running 24/7, I would suggest going the static route. In that case I will help you out doing the necessary changes.
I´ve also found a way to have each VM start with the assigned specific cores in a quad cpu (VM1 to cores 0,1 and VM2 to 2&3), so you dont have to mess around with affinity settings or programs each time you start the VM. This is not documented in the OCN guide though.
Did you read the guide, do you have any questions as to how setting it up?
These are the key commands to have in hand with this distro:
screen -r after starting the VM up and loging in (user: ocn pass: overclock) opens up the client status
control C like in Windows, this stops the SMP client
ifconfig to know the VM IP address
ls to list the files in the root directory where all files are stored.
rm to delete a file or lists of files.
Like it states in the guide, its best, the first time you start up the client, to Control C, and do a ./fah6 -configonly so you can get your user, team and rest of stuff configured, once done, you can either reboot (so it will start again automatically) or do it manually with ./fah6 -smp -verbosity 9
Good luck!
OH, not to worry, it will be a while be for I get that far! I have to first to get just one client running and monitored. You know, walk before I run! I may be an old hand with Folding, but not Folding in Linux!
I've skimmed through it. It will probably be this weekend before I can get to it. If it's warm enough (yes, warm enough), my son and I will be skiing, so I might not do any Folding/VM/Linux training this weekend. Rest assured though, I will call on you, mas0n, and Snarkopod when I get stuck.
Thanks to all of you for your help so far. It's been painful, but I've learned a lot.
This is not the case if you run native Linux. My GPU2 client via WINE under Ubuntu consumes ~9% of an E2200. Just saying
This is very true, but going native with GPU2 under WINE is for the guru linux guys.
Hardly, my first install was 6 weeks ago. :bigggrin: