I don't know what I'd do without my netbook at this point. Its provided me with an environment that is comfortable enough to carry with me and still hold the majority of what I need on it.
Programming while sitting on the couch or even at my girlfriend's families home is one of the many things it used to be difficult to do without overheating your lap or getting tired from having a 7lb+ behemoth on your lap.
I'm certainly interested in where the Atom is going and I'm really looking forward to what looks to be an intense competition for the netbook market.
It saddens me a little bit that so many people haven't had decent small laptops. The thought that to do anything on a couch requires 7lbs and 90F on your thighs is at best incomplete now. There do exist full-fledged computers that are small, powerful, and adequately cooled. If your argument is price, then yes, the netbook creation is possibly the best thing to happen to mobile computing in quite some time. But barring price and just looking at functionality, in between the 9" netbook with a 1.6GHz processor and one gig of RAM and the 17" notebook with a 2.4-2.8GHz processor and up to 4 gigs of RAM, there exist several 12- and 13-inch models with 2.4GHz processors and 4 gigs of RAM that keep your lap cool the whole time - still with a full-size keyboard.
I'm happy that the netbook market will (hopefully) be driving more and more manufacturers into the realm of smaller, but equally functional laptops, but I can't say I entirely understand the current explosion of interest in what is, to me, just underpowered tech repackaged. For the price and usability, they're quite good, but it's not like you couldn't/can't do this on full-powered laptops that are just as powerful as the lap-burners.
You and I agree on this one. I understand the netbook having its place as perhaps that 2nd portable you carry around for that super quick hit on the internet, or perhaps for college students to take class notes. I initially thought the spike in sales was more this type of trend, people buying a 2nd ultra-portable, as a full on laptop replacement, I just feel like we give up too much with this form factor.
Not knocking it, its a cool piece of tech, I just wonder if people are sacrificing a better experience they could have for just a bit more cash.
If literally 85% of the new consumer computers being sold are netbooks (marketing number I read somewhere), Then it can't just be folks looking for a niche product to keep for the right applications, people must be buying their first portable, or replacing old portables this way? It just does not seem like something I would consider for day to day use, sure, It has its applications where its form factor is a real winner, its niche, but I cant see it being my day in day out computing devise, but what do I know if 85 out of 100 consumers are buying one, it can't all be users just looking for an extra portable to fill a niche application?
I have thought about buying one, not as a full time replacement, but for something to carry with me on repair calls to take notes, write invoice, quick access the web if their machine is totally down, that sort of thing, but I am wondering if something like the HP DV2 might offer me a better experience and more overall usability as a real portable laptop replacement, and still be plenty portable.
I will have to get my hands on one to see.
That being said, this article is about the Atom's road map. Other than netbooks, where do you think the Atom will land? I could see if being in a small tablet PC type unit, advanced smart phones maybe?
$1300 will get you a Lenovo X200 at 2.26GHz with 4GB PC3-8500 with a larger, higher-density screen.
:shrug:
I get that it's (at best) triple the price, but I guess I just wanted to point out that you don't NEED to buy a netbook to get portability - they make hardware that has the screen size, hardware power, etc, in similar packaging for those that need the power and want a middle ground.
After having used my MSI Wind (Atom N270) since January, I can confidently say that I will never buy a "full-featured" notebook. Ever.
Mine can't do HD video.
It can't do heavy gaming.
Great. I would go to my desktop if I wanted either of those.
The Atom N270 is equivalent in ability to an Athlon XP 3200+, and that's more than enough to satisfy any task I am going to do on the road. Any task.
I am the poweriest power user there is, and I'm thrilled with my netbook and how it has changed my experience with mobile products. It made the price acceptable, it gives me great battery life, and I can do everything I want.
If you want to lug desktop horsepower around, fine. Pay the $1300 or $2000 or whatever it takes to get that form factor, but for me? No thanks. I'll just go to my desktop. That's what it's there for.
The netbook trend looks like it might drive all mobile hardware increases. Cliff I think is looking in the right direction, smart phones. If they keep the TDP down and battery life keeps getting pushed up, as well as the number of full charges before capacity loss. Then the idea of a netbook that will replace a notebook and a phone that will replace a netbook. I think most of us droll over the Scifi ideas of future computers but to me this is really where we are seeing the start of it all.
SSDs are getting close to large capacities from engineering designs and re-working. Processing speeds are going through the roof. To see the on chip memory controller and dual core in the same roadmap is really impressive.
For Snark: The people that I know and have seen pick up netbooks always bring back out the laptop half the time because they still need the power. Specifically one guy I have class with has a laptop that is the size of his netbook and still uses both. Also I get the impression that the average user doesn't really need much more than what a netbook can do currently, for personal use work use is something completely different in most cases.
I am the poweriest power user there is, and I'm thrilled with my netbook and how it has changed my experience with mobile products.
You can't say you don't do HD video or gaming and call yourself the poweriest power user ever - it's incongruous. You may be the poweriest netbook power user ever, but others will do more with their devices. Secondly, great - if you want to do those things, you'll go to your desktop. That's good for you, for whom the netbook is an extension of your computing life, something that doesn't need to do everything. For those that need a nimble laptop that stands on its own, will a netbook suffice?
As an example, I do watch HD video on my laptop, and do so flying to places that are far from my desktop computer, where I need the power at hand to do my work, which often involves photo editing, heavy Office usage, significant multitasking, etc. I sometimes like to wind down with a game or two at night. Will a netbook suffice for me?
My research says no, while an X200 is a pound? Pound and a half? heavier (2.2lbs vs 3, more with bigger batteries), but has somewhere around double or triple the effective computing power and is, to me, more usable and useful with a full-size keyboard, 1280x800 screen, and the extra horsies underneath.
At CES, I lugged around my 13" MacBook. Thrax hauled around his MSI Wind. By the end of the day, my shoulder was aching. I don't think he had the same problem. His Wind did everything my laptop did without any real issues all while saving him from hauling around un-needed weight. Next time we go to a conference or trade show, I'll be taking something lighter for sure.
Netbooks are to computers what day packs are to backpackers. It's better to have just what you need than to haul around what you don't.
The problem is price Snark. Price to performance. If being able to get a marginally larger screen (an extra 1.5"? Please.), somewhat better horse power with cooling (Not that much more, not enough to go beyond what I would normally do with a laptop.
I rarely, if ever, watch HD video on a small screen. Defeats the purpose to me) and barely comparable battery life (go ahead and watch those videos on battery...*shudder*) costs me an extra $1000, I think that's ridiculous.
It's absurd that to jump from not playing much of any game (I can get WoW running on my HP Mini 10", along with StarCraft) to running at minimal settings for somewhat current games (TF2 maybe?) should cost me almost an entire weeks pay.
If they make a product at ~10" (hell, even 12") that weights ~3 lbs, has great battery life, has that horsepower, and only costs $500-$600, I'll buy one in a heartbeat. The problem is that it shouldn't cost me $1000 for something that barely compares with my 6 year old AMD 3200+ system that cost $1000 when I bought it.
And when the Ion and the Neo come out, I'll be glad to check them out. Not sure how that completely invalidates my points (which are merely that big power can come in a small package), but I'll let you elaborate on that whenever you have time.
MMS, your comparison (a 3200+ to an X200) is entirely unfounded, and I'd love to see some numbers showing that the systems are equivalent. I doubt it. On top of that, I already said that if price was the issue, the netbooks couldn't be beaten. They are fantastic for what they do and what they cost - but the fact that you don't watch HD video on your mobile device does not mean that nobody watches HD video on their mobile devices. As an aside, my X200 has battery life that lasts through two HD movies - though, amusingly, with the screen dimmed and wireless disabled, circling back to the battery thread. If I'm on a plane or a bus, watching a movie is all that I'm doing, so I have no qualms making those tradeoffs.
My point, which has yet again managed to be lost, is simply that for people that need the power, the only choices available to them are not only a netbook or a 17" monstrosity. That's all...
I think I'm following a bit now. I just think its absurd that those looking for power have to pay such a premium. There's no "fill in the gaps" sort of stuff out there at this time.
The HP DV2 with a 12" screen is a gap filler with much better video capability in a package that is still highly portable. Is it enough to justify the greater premium, and the probable trade in battery life? I value video highly, so it might make sense for me, others perhaps not.
It all comes down to what the user values. Are people buying netbooks because the want the ultimate in portability, or do they just want something cheap? If its just cheap, they could buy dual core laptops that function much better in the $500 range, so is that $150 they save is only really worth it if they require that level of portability.
Robert obviously knows his options, so he values the portability, and sees value in it to sacrifice some video performance, he is a smart informed netbook consumer that knew what he was getting into, but how many people are just buying them for a cheap computer? I wonder?
I do not own a laptop/portable computing device. If I was to purchase one it would be a netbook. Here is why: I don't need a portable computer that replaces or does everything my desktop can do.
I like the size and robust ability of for example the MSI Wind. If I wanted to upgrade to a bigger or more powerful portable system I sacrifice at least two things. The first would be price. The price->performance boost from getting a bigger laptop is not a huge gain. With the money I spend on getting a little bit more power from my portable system, I could have just upgraded my desktop. Second I sacrifice portability. Though I am sure there are more powerful systems available that are not much bigger than a netbook, it will cost more.
The final argument is what you plan to use it for. All the things that I would use a laptop for, can be done on a netbook. Everything else I can do on my desktop. I don't think my line of thinking is terribly unique considering the popularity of netbooks.
I love the netbook. It's small, ultra portable, has everything I need, and costs next to nothing. I'm not paying to $1000 or more dollars for a notebook. Now *that* is a sub-par experience for a not-so-insignificant amount of cash. For $500 I can setup a gaming desktop. I don't even want to begin to spend that much on a "small" but unportable computer that can't even play Left 4 Dead properly -- yes, I realize there are laptops that can play L4D properly... but they tend to be way too expensive and they still don't give the proper experience.
The netbook is great because it is the ultra cheap piece of hardware that lets you do all the basics of computing dirt cheap. It's cheaper than a high end celphone/iPhone that allows you to do similar things, but still has enough capability in it to fully type blogs, use P2P, etc. comfortably and easily.
I have an MSI Wind, I never felt like I sacrificed anything while using it. It is powerful enough to playback 720p video, I can type blogs on it all day long, do email, surf, P2P, get on the Tube, and pretty much do everything I do outside of gaming. I realize some people have larger requirements for their basic computing -- Snarks needs power to do graphic work -- and for these people I can understand the need for a more expensive mobile platform that has the power they need. I myself don't have the Netbook to strictly replace my desktop -- I mean it replaces the desktop for my basic computing needs but I still keep a desktop to play games on.
But for the average joe (and even most tech geeks) we are perfectly happy with the basic netbook -- and that is why it is experiencing such monumental success. And we don't need to spend "just a bit more cash" for a "better experience" we don't need.
It's not just a niche application -- people are getting netbooks to replace their desktops or older, larger portables that needed replacing. Again, the average user already gets everything they need for their computing needs on a netbook. It is sleek, sexy, surprisingly powerful, and best of all, dirt cheap. What's not to like?
BTW Cliff for you I don't suggest getting a netbook as a "2nd Portable." People who already have a good laptop shouldn't need to augment it with another netbook. This would be a waste of money in my book. You're better off getting a handheld. In fact, the netbook doesn't replace the handheld at all -- I still carry an iPhone as my handheld for the real on-the-go usage. It's with me everywhere except the office production floor (where it is illegal to carry it); the netbook stays in the car. When you're on call a handheld is a smarter choice. If you want a DV2, well not sure why you need that if you already have a full notebook, if you want something smaller you might as well get something really smaller -- in form and price (netbook) or a device that is in a totally different class (like a PocketPC). But it's your choice.
$1300 will get you a Lenovo X200 at 2.26GHz with 4GB PC3-8500 with a larger, higher-density screen.
:shrug:
I get that it's (at best) triple the price, but I guess I just wanted to point out that you don't NEED to buy a netbook to get portability - they make hardware that has the screen size, hardware power, etc, in similar packaging for those that need the power and want a middle ground.
But alas, the point IS the price. Why spend 3 times as much (more like 4 times as much actually) for something that has extra power we don't need? I understand some people need (or want) that extra power, but most users are not willing to pay the extra premium for an extra 3GB of RAM they don't need, or a few extra Ghz.
I should also point out that X200 isn't also bigger than the average netbook -- 12" from 10" or 9" doesn't sound like much but personally I LIKE them smaller. The X200 isn't quite as portable. I know some "full notebook" models like that 10" Vaio really are as small as a netbook, but they still compromise more than a netbook in some ways (no touchpad!) and cost like 8 times more.
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AnnesTripped Up by Libidos and HubrisAlexandria, VAIcrontian
edited April 2009
Icrontic needs some sort of kickback program from MSI. The number of Winds is growing! ONE OF US! ONE OF US!
Aaaand Mochan SCREAMS past the point, not even looking back.
I'll let most of it go, but I don't know where you're getting the "small but unportable" bit. I've already pointed out that an X200 is .8 lbs heavier than a netbook. If that makes it unportable to you...
Oh, and no touchpad is NOT a compromise. The touchpad is possibly the worst mousing device ever created, but I don't want to start ANOTHER war here.
Thrax, I don't know why but you seem to be missing something.
I have an MSI UX100. The lowest model of the Wind.
And with it I *can* do 720p HD video. I watch it on a regular basis on my Wind, using the Bose Triports for sound.
Also Snarks I should point out, the ONLY task you can't do on a netbook among the list of tasks you pointed out is photo editing. And actually you can, but it's a bit slow. But "heavy Office usage" is hardly something a Netbook can't do, and neither is "significant multitasking." The average netbook can do that easy.
Wind down for a game or two at night? Get a PSP man. Not that the Wind can't do older but still great games like Starcraft, as mentioned. And apparently WoW works, too.
Buddy also mentions the lugging advantage. I am not even content with the MSI Wind; I actually prefer a 9" netbook for even more portability.
Speaking of watching movies, if I wanted to watch a movie on the go, I wouldn't do it on a netbook. I'd do it on my PSP or my iPhone. But I would like to reiterate an Atom-processor enabled Netbook *CAN* do HD Video.
A gig of RAM will not handle the level of multitasking I perform without constantly swapping out and slowing me down. I also prefer a full-size keyboard and a decently-sized screen, both in actual area and pixel density.
The games I like to wind down with involve other people (L4D and TF2). Can't do that on a PSP.
We clearly just have different requirements, and I'm fine with that. For those people like me, there are mid-size full-powered subnotebooks that can suit their needs. For those that need to tap out some documents or do their general computing with something suitable and superlight, there are netbooks for them. For the people that need even more power, there are 10-lb desktop replacement laptops with secondary screens hidden inside them.
Side note, just to get it off my chest - I've been thinking of picking up a Wind for quite some time now to play with. Finances won't currently permit just about anything, though, and I have other financial plans that need to come first whenever they do. I'll gladly play with everybody's at Expo, though.
Uh... depends on your tasks. I can assure you, all the tasks you mentioned save photo-editing will not require constant swapping on 1GB.
I'll give you the keyboard and screen size. Some people just need the larger real estate. I don't -- I am perfectly happy on the Wind's keyboard and I was happy with even just the EEE PC 701's keyboard. I can still do 120wpm on the Wind (but only about 80wpm on the 701's). And some people just need the larger screen, whether for the feel of it or they may have vision problems that require a larger screen.
For me, the screen size isn't so important, screen res is more vital. The screen res should at least be 1024x600. The original screen res of the 701 was just way too low. But 1024x600 is perfectly fine for my uses. 1280x800 would be nice but not necessary. For years I lived on a 1024x768 resolution back in the CRT days and 1024x600 is close enough that I am very comfortable with it.
You are right in saying it boils down to requirements -- some people just need the extra power. But again that doesn't mean the rest of the masses have the same requirements -- and I'll argue that, from the massive success of netbooks in the past few years, it's clear to me that the requirements of most users is closer to mine than yours.
This is perhaps the misfortune of power users like yourself (and myself -- but in a different area) -- we just aren't satisified with the lowest common denominator. We need to have that extra something special. And unfortunately most of that time that extra something costs moolah.
I mean, we both aren't content with stock Apple earbuds -- we pay a premium to have good stuff like the Sennheisser HD600 or the Bose OE Triports. Because our requirements are different from the average user. Most users would scoff at the thought of spending $100 on earphones, much less $200.
So like you said, we have different requirements, and I'm fine with that as well. I can understand your feeling of being a bit "sad" that other people can't get into that extra level of usage that you have. I feel that way too in other areas (like headphones for instance). But I understand that not everybody has the taste for these finer things in life.
I am not sure if a Wind is really a good choice for you to get -- but then again we are tech geeks and we just love to have our gadgets. I mean, I already have like 5 headphones lying around the house and I *still* want to buy the ATH-M500s I saw in the mall. I just put in a sub and an amp with some separates in my car yesterday (man my car is now LOUD) so I'm also out of finances right now but I will probably pick up the M500s next month, or later this month.
PS -- just so you know, the PSP has multiplayer games too. I play Phantasy Star Portable with my GF right now. And Monster Hunter Freedom still owns almost anything else for co-op. Killzone Liberation is also surprisingly fun for fragfests. And they are also playable online, though I prefer to play them adhoc.
LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited April 2009
One thing we need to keep in mind is that everyone's definition of "mobile" is different. For one person it may simply be internet browsing while sipping coffee at the breakfast table, for someone else it is typing a running commentary while traipsing through a huge convention hall.
For me, mobile means having a computer when I travel on business. It sits in my hotel room where I use it for Internet, light office, email, digital photography screening (but not editing) before and after the day's business events. The netbook format would meet my needs, but I still want a 17" laptop with me because the large, rich screen picture and ease of reading are worth it to me. If I were to carry the mobile computer on my person throughout the day, then yes, I'd also have a little netbook.
Intel's Silverthorne and Diamondville chips will be called Atom and the company's Menlow platform for ultramobile computers will be renamed Centrino Atom when these products hit the market, according to a company spokesman.
Some versions of the chip, known by the code name Diamondville, will ship with two-chip chipsets. These processors, which will be available in single-core and dual-core versions, are intended for low-cost notebooks, like Asustek Computers' Eee PC, and inexpensive desktops, respectively.
Thrax
🐌Austin, TX Icrontian
Comments
Programming while sitting on the couch or even at my girlfriend's families home is one of the many things it used to be difficult to do without overheating your lap or getting tired from having a 7lb+ behemoth on your lap.
I'm certainly interested in where the Atom is going and I'm really looking forward to what looks to be an intense competition for the netbook market.
I'm happy that the netbook market will (hopefully) be driving more and more manufacturers into the realm of smaller, but equally functional laptops, but I can't say I entirely understand the current explosion of interest in what is, to me, just underpowered tech repackaged. For the price and usability, they're quite good, but it's not like you couldn't/can't do this on full-powered laptops that are just as powerful as the lap-burners.
You and I agree on this one. I understand the netbook having its place as perhaps that 2nd portable you carry around for that super quick hit on the internet, or perhaps for college students to take class notes. I initially thought the spike in sales was more this type of trend, people buying a 2nd ultra-portable, as a full on laptop replacement, I just feel like we give up too much with this form factor.
Not knocking it, its a cool piece of tech, I just wonder if people are sacrificing a better experience they could have for just a bit more cash.
If literally 85% of the new consumer computers being sold are netbooks (marketing number I read somewhere), Then it can't just be folks looking for a niche product to keep for the right applications, people must be buying their first portable, or replacing old portables this way? It just does not seem like something I would consider for day to day use, sure, It has its applications where its form factor is a real winner, its niche, but I cant see it being my day in day out computing devise, but what do I know if 85 out of 100 consumers are buying one, it can't all be users just looking for an extra portable to fill a niche application?
I have thought about buying one, not as a full time replacement, but for something to carry with me on repair calls to take notes, write invoice, quick access the web if their machine is totally down, that sort of thing, but I am wondering if something like the HP DV2 might offer me a better experience and more overall usability as a real portable laptop replacement, and still be plenty portable.
I will have to get my hands on one to see.
That being said, this article is about the Atom's road map. Other than netbooks, where do you think the Atom will land? I could see if being in a small tablet PC type unit, advanced smart phones maybe?
:shrug:
I get that it's (at best) triple the price, but I guess I just wanted to point out that you don't NEED to buy a netbook to get portability - they make hardware that has the screen size, hardware power, etc, in similar packaging for those that need the power and want a middle ground.
Mine can't do HD video.
It can't do heavy gaming.
Great. I would go to my desktop if I wanted either of those.
The Atom N270 is equivalent in ability to an Athlon XP 3200+, and that's more than enough to satisfy any task I am going to do on the road. Any task.
I am the poweriest power user there is, and I'm thrilled with my netbook and how it has changed my experience with mobile products. It made the price acceptable, it gives me great battery life, and I can do everything I want.
If you want to lug desktop horsepower around, fine. Pay the $1300 or $2000 or whatever it takes to get that form factor, but for me? No thanks. I'll just go to my desktop. That's what it's there for.
SSDs are getting close to large capacities from engineering designs and re-working. Processing speeds are going through the roof. To see the on chip memory controller and dual core in the same roadmap is really impressive.
For Snark: The people that I know and have seen pick up netbooks always bring back out the laptop half the time because they still need the power. Specifically one guy I have class with has a laptop that is the size of his netbook and still uses both. Also I get the impression that the average user doesn't really need much more than what a netbook can do currently, for personal use work use is something completely different in most cases.
You can't say you don't do HD video or gaming and call yourself the poweriest power user ever - it's incongruous. You may be the poweriest netbook power user ever, but others will do more with their devices. Secondly, great - if you want to do those things, you'll go to your desktop. That's good for you, for whom the netbook is an extension of your computing life, something that doesn't need to do everything. For those that need a nimble laptop that stands on its own, will a netbook suffice?
As an example, I do watch HD video on my laptop, and do so flying to places that are far from my desktop computer, where I need the power at hand to do my work, which often involves photo editing, heavy Office usage, significant multitasking, etc. I sometimes like to wind down with a game or two at night. Will a netbook suffice for me?
My research says no, while an X200 is a pound? Pound and a half? heavier (2.2lbs vs 3, more with bigger batteries), but has somewhere around double or triple the effective computing power and is, to me, more usable and useful with a full-size keyboard, 1280x800 screen, and the extra horsies underneath.
Netbooks are to computers what day packs are to backpackers. It's better to have just what you need than to haul around what you don't.
I rarely, if ever, watch HD video on a small screen. Defeats the purpose to me) and barely comparable battery life (go ahead and watch those videos on battery...*shudder*) costs me an extra $1000, I think that's ridiculous.
It's absurd that to jump from not playing much of any game (I can get WoW running on my HP Mini 10", along with StarCraft) to running at minimal settings for somewhat current games (TF2 maybe?) should cost me almost an entire weeks pay.
If they make a product at ~10" (hell, even 12") that weights ~3 lbs, has great battery life, has that horsepower, and only costs $500-$600, I'll buy one in a heartbeat. The problem is that it shouldn't cost me $1000 for something that barely compares with my 6 year old AMD 3200+ system that cost $1000 when I bought it.
MMS, your comparison (a 3200+ to an X200) is entirely unfounded, and I'd love to see some numbers showing that the systems are equivalent. I doubt it. On top of that, I already said that if price was the issue, the netbooks couldn't be beaten. They are fantastic for what they do and what they cost - but the fact that you don't watch HD video on your mobile device does not mean that nobody watches HD video on their mobile devices. As an aside, my X200 has battery life that lasts through two HD movies - though, amusingly, with the screen dimmed and wireless disabled, circling back to the battery thread. If I'm on a plane or a bus, watching a movie is all that I'm doing, so I have no qualms making those tradeoffs.
My point, which has yet again managed to be lost, is simply that for people that need the power, the only choices available to them are not only a netbook or a 17" monstrosity. That's all...
It all comes down to what the user values. Are people buying netbooks because the want the ultimate in portability, or do they just want something cheap? If its just cheap, they could buy dual core laptops that function much better in the $500 range, so is that $150 they save is only really worth it if they require that level of portability.
Robert obviously knows his options, so he values the portability, and sees value in it to sacrifice some video performance, he is a smart informed netbook consumer that knew what he was getting into, but how many people are just buying them for a cheap computer? I wonder?
I like the size and robust ability of for example the MSI Wind. If I wanted to upgrade to a bigger or more powerful portable system I sacrifice at least two things. The first would be price. The price->performance boost from getting a bigger laptop is not a huge gain. With the money I spend on getting a little bit more power from my portable system, I could have just upgraded my desktop. Second I sacrifice portability. Though I am sure there are more powerful systems available that are not much bigger than a netbook, it will cost more.
The final argument is what you plan to use it for. All the things that I would use a laptop for, can be done on a netbook. Everything else I can do on my desktop. I don't think my line of thinking is terribly unique considering the popularity of netbooks.
I love the netbook. It's small, ultra portable, has everything I need, and costs next to nothing. I'm not paying to $1000 or more dollars for a notebook. Now *that* is a sub-par experience for a not-so-insignificant amount of cash. For $500 I can setup a gaming desktop. I don't even want to begin to spend that much on a "small" but unportable computer that can't even play Left 4 Dead properly -- yes, I realize there are laptops that can play L4D properly... but they tend to be way too expensive and they still don't give the proper experience.
The netbook is great because it is the ultra cheap piece of hardware that lets you do all the basics of computing dirt cheap. It's cheaper than a high end celphone/iPhone that allows you to do similar things, but still has enough capability in it to fully type blogs, use P2P, etc. comfortably and easily.
I have an MSI Wind, I never felt like I sacrificed anything while using it. It is powerful enough to playback 720p video, I can type blogs on it all day long, do email, surf, P2P, get on the Tube, and pretty much do everything I do outside of gaming. I realize some people have larger requirements for their basic computing -- Snarks needs power to do graphic work -- and for these people I can understand the need for a more expensive mobile platform that has the power they need. I myself don't have the Netbook to strictly replace my desktop -- I mean it replaces the desktop for my basic computing needs but I still keep a desktop to play games on.
But for the average joe (and even most tech geeks) we are perfectly happy with the basic netbook -- and that is why it is experiencing such monumental success. And we don't need to spend "just a bit more cash" for a "better experience" we don't need.
It's not just a niche application -- people are getting netbooks to replace their desktops or older, larger portables that needed replacing. Again, the average user already gets everything they need for their computing needs on a netbook. It is sleek, sexy, surprisingly powerful, and best of all, dirt cheap. What's not to like?
BTW Cliff for you I don't suggest getting a netbook as a "2nd Portable." People who already have a good laptop shouldn't need to augment it with another netbook. This would be a waste of money in my book. You're better off getting a handheld. In fact, the netbook doesn't replace the handheld at all -- I still carry an iPhone as my handheld for the real on-the-go usage. It's with me everywhere except the office production floor (where it is illegal to carry it); the netbook stays in the car. When you're on call a handheld is a smarter choice. If you want a DV2, well not sure why you need that if you already have a full notebook, if you want something smaller you might as well get something really smaller -- in form and price (netbook) or a device that is in a totally different class (like a PocketPC). But it's your choice.
But alas, the point IS the price. Why spend 3 times as much (more like 4 times as much actually) for something that has extra power we don't need? I understand some people need (or want) that extra power, but most users are not willing to pay the extra premium for an extra 3GB of RAM they don't need, or a few extra Ghz.
I should also point out that X200 isn't also bigger than the average netbook -- 12" from 10" or 9" doesn't sound like much but personally I LIKE them smaller. The X200 isn't quite as portable. I know some "full notebook" models like that 10" Vaio really are as small as a netbook, but they still compromise more than a netbook in some ways (no touchpad!) and cost like 8 times more.
I'll let most of it go, but I don't know where you're getting the "small but unportable" bit. I've already pointed out that an X200 is .8 lbs heavier than a netbook. If that makes it unportable to you...
Oh, and no touchpad is NOT a compromise. The touchpad is possibly the worst mousing device ever created, but I don't want to start ANOTHER war here.
I have an MSI UX100. The lowest model of the Wind.
And with it I *can* do 720p HD video. I watch it on a regular basis on my Wind, using the Bose Triports for sound.
Also Snarks I should point out, the ONLY task you can't do on a netbook among the list of tasks you pointed out is photo editing. And actually you can, but it's a bit slow. But "heavy Office usage" is hardly something a Netbook can't do, and neither is "significant multitasking." The average netbook can do that easy.
Wind down for a game or two at night? Get a PSP man. Not that the Wind can't do older but still great games like Starcraft, as mentioned. And apparently WoW works, too.
Buddy also mentions the lugging advantage. I am not even content with the MSI Wind; I actually prefer a 9" netbook for even more portability.
Speaking of watching movies, if I wanted to watch a movie on the go, I wouldn't do it on a netbook. I'd do it on my PSP or my iPhone. But I would like to reiterate an Atom-processor enabled Netbook *CAN* do HD Video.
The games I like to wind down with involve other people (L4D and TF2). Can't do that on a PSP.
We clearly just have different requirements, and I'm fine with that. For those people like me, there are mid-size full-powered subnotebooks that can suit their needs. For those that need to tap out some documents or do their general computing with something suitable and superlight, there are netbooks for them. For the people that need even more power, there are 10-lb desktop replacement laptops with secondary screens hidden inside them.
Side note, just to get it off my chest - I've been thinking of picking up a Wind for quite some time now to play with. Finances won't currently permit just about anything, though, and I have other financial plans that need to come first whenever they do. I'll gladly play with everybody's at Expo, though.
I'll give you the keyboard and screen size. Some people just need the larger real estate. I don't -- I am perfectly happy on the Wind's keyboard and I was happy with even just the EEE PC 701's keyboard. I can still do 120wpm on the Wind (but only about 80wpm on the 701's). And some people just need the larger screen, whether for the feel of it or they may have vision problems that require a larger screen.
For me, the screen size isn't so important, screen res is more vital. The screen res should at least be 1024x600. The original screen res of the 701 was just way too low. But 1024x600 is perfectly fine for my uses. 1280x800 would be nice but not necessary. For years I lived on a 1024x768 resolution back in the CRT days and 1024x600 is close enough that I am very comfortable with it.
You are right in saying it boils down to requirements -- some people just need the extra power. But again that doesn't mean the rest of the masses have the same requirements -- and I'll argue that, from the massive success of netbooks in the past few years, it's clear to me that the requirements of most users is closer to mine than yours.
This is perhaps the misfortune of power users like yourself (and myself -- but in a different area) -- we just aren't satisified with the lowest common denominator. We need to have that extra something special. And unfortunately most of that time that extra something costs moolah.
I mean, we both aren't content with stock Apple earbuds -- we pay a premium to have good stuff like the Sennheisser HD600 or the Bose OE Triports. Because our requirements are different from the average user. Most users would scoff at the thought of spending $100 on earphones, much less $200.
So like you said, we have different requirements, and I'm fine with that as well. I can understand your feeling of being a bit "sad" that other people can't get into that extra level of usage that you have. I feel that way too in other areas (like headphones for instance). But I understand that not everybody has the taste for these finer things in life.
I am not sure if a Wind is really a good choice for you to get -- but then again we are tech geeks and we just love to have our gadgets. I mean, I already have like 5 headphones lying around the house and I *still* want to buy the ATH-M500s I saw in the mall. I just put in a sub and an amp with some separates in my car yesterday (man my car is now LOUD) so I'm also out of finances right now but I will probably pick up the M500s next month, or later this month.
PS -- just so you know, the PSP has multiplayer games too.
LOL Thrax, the point is 720p is still HD and you did say HD Video.
For me, mobile means having a computer when I travel on business. It sits in my hotel room where I use it for Internet, light office, email, digital photography screening (but not editing) before and after the day's business events. The netbook format would meet my needs, but I still want a 17" laptop with me because the large, rich screen picture and ease of reading are worth it to me. If I were to carry the mobile computer on my person throughout the day, then yes, I'd also have a little netbook.
Menlow is the platform for both desktop and laptop units.
PCWorld: