I think the part that's hard to decipher is exactly how many people go to brick and mortars to grab netbooks. Thats where I got mine, and there wasn't a linux option available with the screen size I wanted (8.9"? No thanks). So I bought an XP netbook, wiped it, and moved on with a Linux distro.
Who cares about MS's tech support, I've never had to use it, and if I *ever* really needed to fix a problem with Windows and I was stumped, I just reformat and reinstall and be done with it.
Oh, and just so you know Drasnor, a 20% return rate is VERY BAD. Almost as bad as the Xbox 360 return rate. ;P
As Thrax said, an acceptable rate for returns is like 2%-5% or so. Any more than that and you have a bad product. The Xbox 360 I think is pushing 30%+. If Linux Netbooks are really hitting 20% (which I seriously doubt) then America would be up in arms suing Asus' ass off and every other netbook manufacturer.
Er, no, there would be no reason to sue anybody, and they would have no grounds to do so. Linux netbook return rates are so high because the public doesn't "get" linux and doesn't understand why they can't use their favorite applications on the system.
"WHERE'S MY MICROSOFT OFFICE XP 2003??!?!1111one"
Also, let me know when that iPhone pops out of the vice grip of Jobs' anus. Maybe then the CrunchPad and the iPhone will be on the same level.
The 360's return rate was only speculated to be close to 30%, and that was only at the beginning of its life cycle. Return rates and failure rates have dropped dramatically with the chipset revision and the heatsink swaps they've been doing for the last two years on returns.
I'm not sure about the failure rates dropping. I know a lot of people on the new Falcon chipset who have had to do returns, and even had dead on arrival units that they had to ship out as soon as they opened the box.
I think the actual failure rate has been revised to a guestimate of about 25% right now, but anyway it's good Thrax that you clarified the 20% rate wasn't actually for hardware/software failures but rather simply for dissatisfaction with the purchase.
Given Microsoft's adversarial tone in the Windows vs. Linux debate, I thought it would have been self-evident.
If memory serves the first netbook was designed with a CPU about half as powerful as the atom, so a light version of Linux was realy necessary at the time because XP just is not a practical OS at that hardware spec.
With the Atom, its a different story, either works fine, and when you compare the price points, its a shame that the Linux books don't offer a better value, with them being that close in price its hard for a user to justify trying it when they can just stick with XP.
Some others have wondered if a future version of the Android OS might be very netbook friendly, but as you have pointed out Robert, Windows 7 seems to work fairly decent on the Atom, so even then it could be an uphill climb for anyone who dare opose MS. I would love to see someone emerge with a real alternative myself, but its going to be difficult to gain traction without something thats revolutionary.
The computing industry's revolutions are dictated by the whims of its users, and those whims overwhelmingly prefer Microsoft. Call it incumbency, call it whatever you want, but a revolution that requires tectonic movement in the operating system won't happen without Microsoft's will.
The computing industry's revolutions are dictated by the whims of its users, and those whims overwhelmingly prefer Microsoft. Call it incumbency, call it whatever you want, but a revolution that requires tectonic movement in the operating system won't happen without Microsoft's will.
Especially when Microsoft makes a decent product. I have yet to meet someone using any Windows 7 build 7000 or later that says anything horrible about the experience. Sure, we have our minor quibbles with it, but overall, its as solid as you can expect in beta form. Better than Vista in every way.
So MS is nearly impossible to fight with when they make lousy products, when they make a good one, its going to be an uphill battle for anyone to penetrate that market, though I would love to see a little healthy competition.
If for nothing else, I can see the value of Linux on any home productivity only machine. I mean if your purpose is the browse, email, office tasks, organize photos and music, Linux give you a great platform to do that on without the constant updates and malware attacks. It makes perfect sense for a certain type of user, the problem is, the type of user it makes sense for, is also going to be the type of user that is most afraid to change their experience.
Perhaps a name brand like Google can do something to challenge that in the future, but I am afraid your right, putting a real challenge forth against a product like Windows 7 is going to be nearly impossible.
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LeonardoWake up and smell the glaciersEagle River, AlaskaIcrontian
edited April 2009
tectonic movement in the operating system won't happen without Microsoft's will
Agree. There is so little real competition that Microsoft hasn't even had to lower prices, which they could easily do. We all complain about how expenisive Windows is, but by and large, the legal market for Windows, with the exceptions of Me and Vista, have flourished quite handsomely. Any serious competition and Microsoft could quickly lower prices. I think the introducition of Windows 7 will just solidify the Windows dominance for a long time to come. The introduction of an apparently very good OS is a card well played, in and of itself.
Especially when Microsoft makes a decent product. I have yet to meet someone using any Windows 7 build 7000 or later that says anything horrible about the experience. Sure, we have our minor quibbles with it, but overall, its as solid as you can expect in beta form. Better than Vista in every way.
For a while it looked like we were going to be stuck with Vista for as long as we've had XP. It seemed to me that that feeling drove a lot of mainstream interest in the Linux platform. Windows 7 is a decent product though so the people who wanted to switch to Linux to get away from a Vista future now have no reason to.
Also, as far as I know Linux doesn't compete with Windows. Linux is free so concepts like market share and market penetration have no meaning. The companies that develop and distribute Linux aren't in any way accountable to their users. While this allows a great deal of freedom with regards to how you use the software it can be (and is) very frustrating to people accustomed to paid support.
Thrax
🐌Austin, TX Icrontian
Comments
I'm holding out for a CrunchPad
http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/04/10/about-those-new-crunchpad-pictures/
Easily the wisest thing anyone will post on the net all day.
Community support beats the corporate heads hands down.
-drasnor
As Thrax said, an acceptable rate for returns is like 2%-5% or so. Any more than that and you have a bad product. The Xbox 360 I think is pushing 30%+. If Linux Netbooks are really hitting 20% (which I seriously doubt) then America would be up in arms suing Asus' ass off and every other netbook manufacturer.
I have taht thing you call a CrunchPad, Jared. Except mine fits in my pocket... and it's called an iPhone. :P
"WHERE'S MY MICROSOFT OFFICE XP 2003??!?!1111one"
Also, let me know when that iPhone pops out of the vice grip of Jobs' anus. Maybe then the CrunchPad and the iPhone will be on the same level.
I think the actual failure rate has been revised to a guestimate of about 25% right now, but anyway it's good Thrax that you clarified the 20% rate wasn't actually for hardware/software failures but rather simply for dissatisfaction with the purchase.
-drasnor
If memory serves the first netbook was designed with a CPU about half as powerful as the atom, so a light version of Linux was realy necessary at the time because XP just is not a practical OS at that hardware spec.
With the Atom, its a different story, either works fine, and when you compare the price points, its a shame that the Linux books don't offer a better value, with them being that close in price its hard for a user to justify trying it when they can just stick with XP.
Some others have wondered if a future version of the Android OS might be very netbook friendly, but as you have pointed out Robert, Windows 7 seems to work fairly decent on the Atom, so even then it could be an uphill climb for anyone who dare opose MS. I would love to see someone emerge with a real alternative myself, but its going to be difficult to gain traction without something thats revolutionary.
Especially when Microsoft makes a decent product. I have yet to meet someone using any Windows 7 build 7000 or later that says anything horrible about the experience. Sure, we have our minor quibbles with it, but overall, its as solid as you can expect in beta form. Better than Vista in every way.
So MS is nearly impossible to fight with when they make lousy products, when they make a good one, its going to be an uphill battle for anyone to penetrate that market, though I would love to see a little healthy competition.
If for nothing else, I can see the value of Linux on any home productivity only machine. I mean if your purpose is the browse, email, office tasks, organize photos and music, Linux give you a great platform to do that on without the constant updates and malware attacks. It makes perfect sense for a certain type of user, the problem is, the type of user it makes sense for, is also going to be the type of user that is most afraid to change their experience.
Perhaps a name brand like Google can do something to challenge that in the future, but I am afraid your right, putting a real challenge forth against a product like Windows 7 is going to be nearly impossible.
Also, as far as I know Linux doesn't compete with Windows. Linux is free so concepts like market share and market penetration have no meaning. The companies that develop and distribute Linux aren't in any way accountable to their users. While this allows a great deal of freedom with regards to how you use the software it can be (and is) very frustrating to people accustomed to paid support.
-drasnor