Opinions please

Mt_GoatMt_Goat Head Cheezy KnobPflugerville (north of Austin) Icrontian
edited October 2003 in Folding@Home
In the spirit of things I have been pondering some ideas for a "Space Saver Farm". My idea is to get one of those steel shelving units (20"W x 14"D x however high I need) and put several system rack style with standoffs mounted in the shelf for the mobos and just screw the HDD's and PSU's to the frame. Put one monitor at eyelevel while sitting. I figure I can get 2 to a shelf with 8" between shelves. It would probably be cheap boards an XP2400's. I would most likely start with 4 and just mount a 6 1/2" fan on one end of each shelf for air circulation and it will all be open. Will it work? If not, why? Also will old HDD's impair performance. I figure not counting the shelf unit itself, I can build each for $110.00 with Fry's deals on the mobo/CPU and HDD's and vid cards for $5.00 each from the Goodwill store. No need for CD-Rom or Floppy and use one spare of those for set-up puposes.
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Comments

  • profdlpprofdlp The Holy City Of Westlake, Ohio
    edited October 2003
    Only caveat I see would be in mounting the MB's to the shelves. I would be careful about "ground" issues, since you conceiveably could have all of your boards sharing a common ground.

    I know they all eventually get grounded to the same place, but my laymans knowledge of electricity tells me that how they are grounded matters as much as where.

    This sounds like a neat idea - I hope you can send us some pictures when you get it going!

    :thumbsup::fold:
  • Mt_GoatMt_Goat Head Cheezy Knob Pflugerville (north of Austin) Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    If common grounding would be an issue I could just get a different kind of shelf that has a steel frame and has particleboard for the shelf itself then replace the particleboard with plexiglass. I am kind of concerned on the HD mounting and was considering using a rubberized isolator for other mechanical use to help eliminate harmonic vibration between all the drives. Good poit Prof.
  • TBonZTBonZ Ottawa, ON Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    Sounds fantastic to me and can't see why this wouldn't work, go for it! :respect:
  • Mt_GoatMt_Goat Head Cheezy Knob Pflugerville (north of Austin) Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    TBonZ had this to say
    Sounds fantastic to me and can't see why this wouldn't work, go for it! :respect:

    Cool!!!

    Should I worry about the HD mounting at all or just screw them to the holes in the uprights?
  • profdlpprofdlp The Holy City Of Westlake, Ohio
    edited October 2003
    mtgoat had this to say
    ...I am kind of concerned on the HD mounting and was considering using a rubberized isolator for other mechanical use to help eliminate harmonic vibration between all the drives.
    Hang 'em from the shelf above it with tiny chains.

    (Hey, I'm not cheap, I'm creative!) :vimp:
  • Mt_GoatMt_Goat Head Cheezy Knob Pflugerville (north of Austin) Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    profdlp had this to say
    mtgoat had this to say
    ...I am kind of concerned on the HD mounting and was considering using a rubberized isolator for other mechanical use to help eliminate harmonic vibration between all the drives.
    Hang 'em from the shelf above it with tiny chains.

    (Hey, I'm not cheap, I'm creative!) :vimp:
    cheaper yet, monofiliment fishing line about 20lb test. reminisent of hanging stereo speakers back in the '70s. :thumbsup:
  • BDRBDR
    edited October 2003
    Mtgoat, it sounds like you are about to get competitive. :D

    I'd love to see pics of the set up when it's ready.
  • drasnordrasnor Starship Operator Hawthorne, CA Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    Someone from HardOCP or Overclockers did this a while back (mounted on a 1x10 plank) and figured out how to attach two mobos to each power supply. Try google.

    -drasnor :fold:
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    OOH, this may have just become the official Thread to Watch ! Man, this is a great idea!
  • WuGgaRoOWuGgaRoO Not in the shower Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    that all sounds grand mtgoat..however...do u remember what ur wife said when she heard of the videocard....i mean its a phenominial idea....but dop u really wanna upset the misses...(not poking fun just being too responsible)
  • seversphereseversphere
    edited October 2003
    http://ws9.jobnegotiator.com/html/flinks.html
  • BuiesCreek847BuiesCreek847 In a van, down by the river, NC Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    mtgoat had this to say
    Will it work?
    Heck yeah! I used the plastic shelf unit so as to negate any grounding problems. Most are Biostar M7VKQs. I've mounted the HDDs behind the PSUs on the back of the shelfs using tye-raps.

    TheFarm1.jpg
  • LeonardoLeonardo Wake up and smell the glaciers Eagle River, Alaska Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    Well, heck, if AMDMB can do it, we CERTAINLY could! ha ha

    Hey BC, good to see you. You guys are really our cousins, no doubt.
  • Mt_GoatMt_Goat Head Cheezy Knob Pflugerville (north of Austin) Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    First I want to thank seversphere for the cool link. It even gave me the idea to look for old bakery racks that could be had for free.

    This is going to take a little while to get going, mostly since I haven't worked since Heather got hit by the car and you all know the rest. I need to get work lined up first then start getting the house fixed up so we can sell it and move to Alaska. I am looking for work up there right now also. In the middle of all this I will start collecting my parts and do what I can to get it going. I am shooting for January for operation. My plan is to do as much as possible with very little out of pocket. I don't know as much about competitive as maybe compusive. I tend to get very involved in anything I get into.
  • BDRBDR
    edited October 2003
    mtgoat had this to say
    I don't know as much about competitive as maybe compusive. I tend to get very involved in anything I get into.

    Now you sound like me, MG.

    I'll have to look around and see if there's anything I can donate to you, to help out.

    Don't forget the cost of electricity to run these things too.
    My power meter spins like this -> :eek3:;D
  • csimoncsimon Acadiana Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    I would imagine that moblie cpus would be more costly up front but in the long run you wouldn't need a nuke plant to run them!

    as for cooling ...I'm thinking that you will use box sets with the stock sinks and fans with 6.5" fans blowing across each shelf?

    lots and lots of possibilities here ...once you get to around 25 cpus you'll be chasing me!!! :fold:
  • profdlpprofdlp The Holy City Of Westlake, Ohio
    edited October 2003
    I've got some stuff I could donate, too. (The SMx project gets first dibs, but so far nothing I've offered has been needed.)

    Mostly what I have are some dinky HD's (4.3GB to 8.4GB) and old 4MB & 8MB PCI video cards.

    BTW - BDR, your avatar is pretty cool (creepy cool...) :hiding:
  • BDRBDR
    edited October 2003
    BuiesCreek847, thanks for re-posting that. The first didn't load for me.

    Something similar was suggested to me by someone a few months back. It looks like a very workable system.

    Are those Speeze coolers? I have one just like them.



    and profdlp, thanks. The avi is one I made long ago and added the eyes to about 4 months ago. It's my trademark avi.
  • BuiesCreek847BuiesCreek847 In a van, down by the river, NC Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    BDR had this to say
    BuiesCreek847, thanks for re-posting that. The first didn't load for me.

    Something similar was suggested to me by someone a few months back. It looks like a very workable system.

    Are those Speeze coolers? I have one just like them.
    Yup, Speeze mod. 5F263B1M3G ($7 from Newegg). They work quite well, and I like the fact that they run @ 2500rpm, so there's much less noise. ;)

    And thanks Leonardo! Our Teams friendship has stood the test of time. It's unfortunate that in the competition of things, some teams have to go to the Xtreme and be ........... kinda .......... snotty. :rolleyes:
  • edcentricedcentric near Milwaukee, Wisconsin Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    1. would mobos with cheap integrated video be easier to work with.
    2. Didn't we have the hdd discusion a while back, concerning running without a hdd. They will need to be networked anyway.
    3. I wish that I could do this {envey}
  • seversphereseversphere
    edited October 2003
    cheap everything onboard mobos are perfect cause no pci cards or agp cards to increase bulk. Having hdd is the easiest way to go - but whoever wants to network boot to ramdrive or run a linux diskless farm is more than welcome!
  • drasnordrasnor Starship Operator Hawthorne, CA Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    I'm using a couple of old CD-ROMs and Knoppix CD's for a diskless configuration with a couple of my machines, since I used to ;) have a pile of decrepit CD readers lying around and my largest spare hard drive is a 120MB.

    I'm using Eidolon, the version modified by Overclockix and linked to in the "Everything about Folding@Home" thread. It took me 30 minutes to set up the first machine and 5 minutes to set up the second, and I'm a linux n00b. There's scripts to do everything for you (configure, stop, and start Folding). It's really nice.

    -drasnor :fold:
  • Mt_GoatMt_Goat Head Cheezy Knob Pflugerville (north of Austin) Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    BuiesCreek847

    Thanks for posting that pic and the encouragement! I think it might take a while to get that far. Judging by the looks of the HS's i saw on most of those boards you are doing some decent OC action too! ;)

    Thanks for the offers and I will let you all know what's kicking. But first as I said I need to get some priorities sorted out first. I currently have 6 sticks of PC-133 RAM (which is why the Fry's combos w/ ECS K7S5A Pro's is going to be a mainstay), 5 assorted vid cards (all low end), 2 XP1800's, a couple floppy drives and 2 spare CD-ROM's.
  • muddocktormuddocktor
    edited October 2003
    mtgoat, a guy over at overclockers.com called Gator, wrote this document I'm attaching which is a "How To" on setting up a diskless multi-node Linux farm for folding. If you go to their forums and run a search on "Yattamonster", you will come up with several thread where some of their folks have set up multi-node diskless folding setups. One guy built his to where the psu's were shared between 2 mobo's for every psu he used. I think he was only using some Durons, which don't draw as much power as the XP's. He used some Biostar mobos for his setup because they had onboard video and lan and supported booting from the network.
  • Geeky1Geeky1 University of the Pacific (Stockton, CA, USA)
    edited October 2003
    Why not do a network boot, like seversphere mentioned? If you do that, you won't have to spend anything on a bunch of drives...

    Also, if you wanted to run a UPS for it, you could build one... Dan (of Dan's Data) did an article about it a while back. All you need is some lead acid batteries, a large +12v ps (car battery charger/starter) and an inverter with a large enough capacity to run the attached devices. The only issue is that lead acid batteries generate hydrogen when being charged. Hydrogen gas is explosive. So, you'd want to keep the batteries in a well-ventillated area. Like outside. Which, in Alaska, may pose problems...
  • mmonninmmonnin Centreville, VA
    edited October 2003
    http://www.dealsonic.com/pow40sinfana.html

    $16 PSU shipped or $110 for 10 w/o shipping.

    I so want to learn how to do this. Too bad I am in college and cant really afford this.
  • BDRBDR
    edited October 2003
    mmonnin, do you think those are any good?

    I could use a couple just for back ups.
  • Geeky1Geeky1 University of the Pacific (Stockton, CA, USA)
    edited October 2003
    BDR... SUPPOSEDLY those PSes are decent (a number of people here swear by them). Personally, I have some reservations about using a "400w" $16 PS, but if they work, they work...
  • mmonninmmonnin Centreville, VA
    edited October 2003
    They would work for something like this.
  • csimoncsimon Acadiana Icrontian
    edited October 2003
    lets see ...4 operton 800 series systems would give you 32 processors ...screaming processors I might add ...and how efficient it would be to have 8 processors per board ...or am I still dreaming? :fold:
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