I don't know what I'm going to use this for yet but it seemed nice to have. @d3k0y: have used joystick and spaceplanes are marginally controllable in air. It's very difficult to fly them manually since there is no trim. The typical solution is to put an advanced SAS on them for hands-off flying or a spaceplane SAS if you really want to go manual. A normal computer joystick does not lend itself well to flying spacecraft in space though a 3D mouse with decoupled axes would be ok.
All of my current rocket designs are awful, my lander and command module I know are solid but I can't make orbit.
Did they change the thrust ratios on some of the smaller rockets because I've found three of them on a heavy stage lander/command module just don't have the force to establish an orbit before I run out of fuel and have to abort.
"If you can get your ship into orbit, you're halfway to anywhere." - Robert Heinleins from A Step Farther Out by Jerry Pournelle.
If you're trying to launch both a lander and a command module, its likely that they are heavy. For me to get a similar mass into space + low orbit (and admittedly I could get to the moon on the main stage), I used a total of 22 of the 1440 size fuel tanks on my main lift stage. I also used asparagus style (thanks @Drasnor) for the atmospheric stage to stay near terminal velocity on the way up.
My asparagus testing showed something like 150% performance of the "drop as you go" style staging.
By comparison, my lander / return module is relatively small:
In other words, I'm using the mainsails to quickly / easily / wastefully get me to orbit. What do you mean by smaller? If you wanted to just propel your lander command module, I think you'd need at least a LV-T30 / LV-T45.
So I threw in some more fuel tanks which allowed me to keep my mid stage booster long enough to establish orbit. After a botched orbital docking procedure I managed to attach my command and lander modules at the nose.
Unfortunately my munar trajectory didn't allow for me to establish an orbit resulting in both the command module and lander module colliding into the surface despite 5 minutes of solid fuel burn trying to decrease speed.
The modular vehicle I made while inebriated a few posts back is launched on a common booster. Each booster core has 9 engines, 8 of the non-vectoring standard small engine and one in the central position with vectoring. Not shown is the standard-size docking collar on the top of the medium-size fuel tank at the same height as the stack separator. Detail view of the lander and orbiter. I launch to Kerbin orbit in this configuration with the lander's nuclear engines boosting the rest of the way to orbit. Once in orbit, I blow the aft stack separator and rotate the orbiter/lander assembly 180 degrees to align the lander top docking collar with the docking collar on the medium fuel tank and dock. The resulting vehicle looks like what I had in the earlier post. I added the drogue chutes on the lander more recently since my original inebriated attempt disintegrated on parachute deploy during the Duna entry-descent-landing.
Wheels stop! Check out the MET; hope these guys had the cryostasis feature from the Pyro GX featured in Descent 2 & 3. I had real problems getting out of Jool space. I ended up in a really, really high heliocentric orbit and it took a couple of days of real time to get phased right for minimum fuel return. I'm actually kind of surprised I was able to pull it off; having a good departure stage and carrying a nuclear engine right on the docking coupler helped a lot. I netted ~5k science on this mission.
The Peregrine Mk3 (pictured above) is an SSTO spaceplane. Once on-orbit, it rendezvoused and docked with my space station to refuel and then rendezvoused and docked with my deep space booster module: The deep space booster consists of the departure stage (the grey part above the center core) with a nuclear engine and docking collar on top. Once the departure stage is spent, all orbital operations are performed with just the NERVA on the deep space booster stage drawing fuel from the spaceplane tanks. I left the deep space booster stage in low Kerbin orbit with a full fuel and oxidizer load but basically no monopropellant. I did a lot of orbital maneuvers on the RCS to save propellant. And yeah, that's a command chair on the side.
I did the Laythe Spaceplane again in 0.23 vanilla. The new RAPIER engine really makes flying the spaceplane easier and the new science module makes the mission much, much more lucrative. Full album 6500 science
I was in the mood for The Right Stuff tonight and afterwards I was inspired. Here we go NF-104A spaceplane SSTO with stock KSP parts: Album link: imgur.com/a/12xGt
That thing is sleek. I would be interested in a video showing how you got to orbit. For some reason, the skill eludes me.
I understand the idea is to get as high as air engines will allow and then as horizontally fast as you can before using rockets, but the actual execution is failing me.
That thing is sleek. I would be interested in a video showing how you got to orbit. For some reason, the skill eludes me.
I understand the idea is to get as high as air engines will allow and then as horizontally fast as you can before using rockets, but the actual execution is failing me.
I landed it in the desert for consistency. Here's how I normally do a spaceplane orbital insertion:
1) Take off using air, maintain shallow climb until you're going fast enough to have good pitch authority. This basically means you aren't having to hold down the pitch control to maintain attitude. 2) Zoom to 10,000 m as fast as you can. Some of my spaceplanes can maintain climb at 90 degrees which makes this part quick. My older ones (and the KF-104) have T/W < 1 during this mission phase and have to climb on lift alone (35 - 55 deg climb attitude). 3) Start leveling off at 10,000 m and let it climb at ~100 m/s at a shallower climb attitude. This is typically 10 - 30 deg on my spaceplanes. 4) Once you clear 20,000 m, try to keep the climb under 100 m/s while you build downrange speed. You want to be going as fast as possible before cutting in the rockets. 5) Watch your intake air rates. The faster you go, the higher you can get before you flame out. Once it gets down below 0.4 though it's time to think about switching to rockets. 6) Once it looks like you're about to flame out (hopefully altitude above 25 km and downrange speed > 1.5 km/s) cut in the rockets and shut down the jets. Immediately go to a more aggressive climb attitude (45 - 60 deg). 7) Switch to map mode and watch your apogee. Once you clear (or are about to clear) 70 km, switch back to vehicle view and cut your throttle. 8) Coast to apogee and circularize. Should only take 300 - 500 m/s.
I notionally have Twitch TV installed but I have no idea how it works. Mumble?
Also, you are aware that you can pull up the nav ball in map mode to set throttle, yes? Should save a bit of switching back and forth. Otherwise, nice SSTO!
Also, you are aware that you can pull up the nav ball in map mode to set throttle, yes? Should save a bit of switching back and forth. Otherwise, nice SSTO!
I am now. I knew you could pull up the nav ball but I didn't know that unlocked the throttle control. Thanks!
It's eight ram intakes total; four on each side with a circular intake on each side as well. All told it's 10 intakes on the vehicle. I explored an eight-per side configuration but I didn't like the way it looked and the four-per side configuration gets the job done. The circular intakes fill out the base of the inlet clusters and prevent flameouts during the takeoff roll.
@CannonFodder Nice! I used to do fewer; it just makes it harder .
So, sit back and relax, 'cause boy do I have a story for you.... [Only one of my screen shots got uploaded to Steam for some reason, so sorry for lack of image].
As a noob, many things in KSP are a challenge. The furthest I'd ever been on career mode was the arctic. (This is from another career mode) One, very restless night, I decided I'd set my goals high. I'd gotten a lot of parts on previous excursions, and I thought I was ready for something big. "Tonight," I said to myself,"I'm going to the Mun". I designed and built what seemed to me a flawless rocket. I launched and plowed through the atmosphere, making all other rockets seem like junk. I set my orbits, and got myself into the Mun's sphere of influence. It grabbed me, and slowly pulled me towards it. I lowered myself onto it's dull surface. Only, It was pitch black. I started to panic, and mind you, my rocket had lights. Except that their light only hit the lander. Where was the ground? As I neared the ground, rocks flitted past my eyes, so I blasted my engines, launching me higher than intended. Then, as I fell, my rocket hit the ground. It tumbled over, condemning my poor Kerbal, my poor... JEB. That's right, my rocket carried the most important Kerbal in Kerbal-Kind. I had to do something, and fast. I hurried to the VAB and made another rocket, Hermes IV. This rocket was a satellite with a compartment below to house my precious Jeb. I launched it, made an orbit, and prepared to land on the Mun. As I neared the surface, I realised my fuel was running low. This isn't good... I made a near perfect landing, except guess what? It tilted over. But alas, with a sleight of the finger, I propped it back up! The problem? Jeb was 5 kilometers away. I switched over to him, and started walking, up a treacherous mountain. As I reached the top, with @primesuspect and @CannonFodder watching, I began to tumble down the slope. Poor Jeb bounced and flew closer to the rescue rocket, with the gang laughing behind the screen. Soon, with Jeb still flailing, I noticed glinting not too far away... The rescue rocket! Jeb stopped his tumbling, and I used my EVA fuel to hover him over to it. (Here is Jeb and Hermes IV). He got in, and began the launch. He made an orbit, and extended it. My fuel was dangerously low. Suddenly, while I was in map mode, the orbit stopped, and with it, my finally hope of seeing Kerbin. But something made me continue on. I launched a new rocket, Hermes IV.2 of the same design, only with more fuel. I made an orbit around the Mun and waited until I reached it. The only catch? I'd never done a rendezvous. I matched the orbits, and made Hermes IV.2 slow itself to make the two rockets virtually stand still. Suddenly, Hermes IV launched past me! I switched over to it and quickly eject Jeb. Now, he is alone in Space. He floats, peacefully, blissfully... But I jumped into action. Using the rest of my EVA fuel, I ungracefully flew him to Hermes IV.2. He got in, and flew away, leaving Hermes IV as monument to my noobiness. He extended the orbit onto Kerbin, and landed on its green, grassy surface. Jeb is safe!
And, I only got 20 science.
Thank you @CannonFodder for guiding me through all the steps of rescuing my Kerbal. I learned many-a valuable lesson that night.
Comments
@d3k0y: have used joystick and spaceplanes are marginally controllable in air. It's very difficult to fly them manually since there is no trim. The typical solution is to put an advanced SAS on them for hands-off flying or a spaceplane SAS if you really want to go manual. A normal computer joystick does not lend itself well to flying spacecraft in space though a 3D mouse with decoupled axes would be ok.
Did they change the thrust ratios on some of the smaller rockets because I've found three of them on a heavy stage lander/command module just don't have the force to establish an orbit before I run out of fuel and have to abort.
"If you can get your ship into orbit, you're halfway to anywhere." - Robert Heinleins from A Step Farther Out by Jerry Pournelle.
If you're trying to launch both a lander and a command module, its likely that they are heavy. For me to get a similar mass into space + low orbit (and admittedly I could get to the moon on the main stage), I used a total of 22 of the 1440 size fuel tanks on my main lift stage. I also used asparagus style (thanks @Drasnor) for the atmospheric stage to stay near terminal velocity on the way up.
My asparagus testing showed something like 150% performance of the "drop as you go" style staging.
By comparison, my lander / return module is relatively small:
In other words, I'm using the mainsails to quickly / easily / wastefully get me to orbit. What do you mean by smaller? If you wanted to just propel your lander command module, I think you'd need at least a LV-T30 / LV-T45.
(edit: broken link)
Unfortunately my munar trajectory didn't allow for me to establish an orbit resulting in both the command module and lander module colliding into the surface despite 5 minutes of solid fuel burn trying to decrease speed.
Each booster core has 9 engines, 8 of the non-vectoring standard small engine and one in the central position with vectoring. Not shown is the standard-size docking collar on the top of the medium-size fuel tank at the same height as the stack separator.
Detail view of the lander and orbiter. I launch to Kerbin orbit in this configuration with the lander's nuclear engines boosting the rest of the way to orbit. Once in orbit, I blow the aft stack separator and rotate the orbiter/lander assembly 180 degrees to align the lander top docking collar with the docking collar on the medium fuel tank and dock. The resulting vehicle looks like what I had in the earlier post. I added the drogue chutes on the lander more recently since my original inebriated attempt disintegrated on parachute deploy during the Duna entry-descent-landing.
I have never cursed so much as having dead satellites.
the worst is including them, but forgetting to open them until you're on the dark side of the planet.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/220200/?20130914
So much science! Atmospheric scans on Laythe are worth a lot of points.
I had real problems getting out of Jool space. I ended up in a really, really high heliocentric orbit and it took a couple of days of real time to get phased right for minimum fuel return. I'm actually kind of surprised I was able to pull it off; having a good departure stage and carrying a nuclear engine right on the docking coupler helped a lot. I netted ~5k science on this mission.
The deep space booster consists of the departure stage (the grey part above the center core) with a nuclear engine and docking collar on top. Once the departure stage is spent, all orbital operations are performed with just the NERVA on the deep space booster stage drawing fuel from the spaceplane tanks.
I left the deep space booster stage in low Kerbin orbit with a full fuel and oxidizer load but basically no monopropellant. I did a lot of orbital maneuvers on the RCS to save propellant. And yeah, that's a command chair on the side.
Full album
6500 science
Album link: imgur.com/a/12xGt
I understand the idea is to get as high as air engines will allow and then as horizontally fast as you can before using rockets, but the actual execution is failing me.
1) Take off using air, maintain shallow climb until you're going fast enough to have good pitch authority. This basically means you aren't having to hold down the pitch control to maintain attitude.
2) Zoom to 10,000 m as fast as you can. Some of my spaceplanes can maintain climb at 90 degrees which makes this part quick. My older ones (and the KF-104) have T/W < 1 during this mission phase and have to climb on lift alone (35 - 55 deg climb attitude).
3) Start leveling off at 10,000 m and let it climb at ~100 m/s at a shallower climb attitude. This is typically 10 - 30 deg on my spaceplanes.
4) Once you clear 20,000 m, try to keep the climb under 100 m/s while you build downrange speed. You want to be going as fast as possible before cutting in the rockets.
5) Watch your intake air rates. The faster you go, the higher you can get before you flame out. Once it gets down below 0.4 though it's time to think about switching to rockets.
6) Once it looks like you're about to flame out (hopefully altitude above 25 km and downrange speed > 1.5 km/s) cut in the rockets and shut down the jets. Immediately go to a more aggressive climb attitude (45 - 60 deg).
7) Switch to map mode and watch your apogee. Once you clear (or are about to clear) 70 km, switch back to vehicle view and cut your throttle.
8) Coast to apogee and circularize. Should only take 300 - 500 m/s.
I notionally have Twitch TV installed but I have no idea how it works. Mumble?
Also, you are aware that you can pull up the nav ball in map mode to set throttle, yes? Should save a bit of switching back and forth. Otherwise, nice SSTO!
@CannonFodder Nice! I used to do fewer; it just makes it harder
As a noob, many things in KSP are a challenge. The furthest I'd ever been on career mode was the arctic. (This is from another career mode)
One, very restless night, I decided I'd set my goals high. I'd gotten a lot of parts on previous excursions, and I thought I was ready for something big.
"Tonight," I said to myself,"I'm going to the Mun".
I designed and built what seemed to me a flawless rocket. I launched and plowed through the atmosphere, making all other rockets seem like junk. I set my orbits, and got myself into the Mun's sphere of influence. It grabbed me, and slowly pulled me towards it. I lowered myself onto it's dull surface. Only, It was pitch black. I started to panic, and mind you, my rocket had lights. Except that their light only hit the lander. Where was the ground? As I neared the ground, rocks flitted past my eyes, so I blasted my engines, launching me higher than intended. Then, as I fell, my rocket hit the ground. It tumbled over, condemning my poor Kerbal, my poor... JEB. That's right, my rocket carried the most important Kerbal in Kerbal-Kind. I had to do something, and fast. I hurried to the VAB and made another rocket, Hermes IV. This rocket was a satellite with a compartment below to house my precious Jeb. I launched it, made an orbit, and prepared to land on the Mun. As I neared the surface, I realised my fuel was running low. This isn't good... I made a near perfect landing, except guess what? It tilted over. But alas, with a sleight of the finger, I propped it back up! The problem? Jeb was 5 kilometers away. I switched over to him, and started walking, up a treacherous mountain.
As I reached the top, with @primesuspect and @CannonFodder watching, I began to tumble down the slope. Poor Jeb bounced and flew closer to the rescue rocket, with the gang laughing behind the screen. Soon, with Jeb still flailing, I noticed glinting not too far away... The rescue rocket! Jeb stopped his tumbling, and I used my EVA fuel to hover him over to it.
(Here is Jeb and Hermes IV).
He got in, and began the launch. He made an orbit, and extended it. My fuel was dangerously low. Suddenly, while I was in map mode, the orbit stopped, and with it, my finally hope of seeing Kerbin. But something made me continue on. I launched a new rocket, Hermes IV.2 of the same design, only with more fuel. I made an orbit around the Mun and waited until I reached it. The only catch? I'd never done a rendezvous. I matched the orbits, and made Hermes IV.2 slow itself to make the two rockets virtually stand still. Suddenly, Hermes IV launched past me! I switched over to it and quickly eject Jeb. Now, he is alone in Space. He floats, peacefully, blissfully... But I jumped into action. Using the rest of my EVA fuel, I ungracefully flew him to Hermes IV.2. He got in, and flew away, leaving Hermes IV as monument to my noobiness. He extended the orbit onto Kerbin, and landed on its green, grassy surface. Jeb is safe!
And, I only got 20 science.
Thank you @CannonFodder for guiding me through all the steps of rescuing my Kerbal. I learned many-a valuable lesson that night.