now that I think about it, I wonder if it can affect motherboards too. I had stress tested a system for a week with Folding and prime95. I had ati drivers off the cd for that week. Then installed the 3.8 drivers to test out playing games. I could play games for a few minutes then blue screen with page fault errors. Eventually a chip on the mobo burned up right after reset during posting. Only thing is it's a 9200 128mb card and supposedly not affected by this. I've used the card in three other systems and it's fine with 3.7 drivers and no way am I gonna test 3.8s again. Is it definite that 9200 are not affected?
AFAIK, the 9600, 9200, 9100, 9000, 8500 & earlier cards are not supposed to be affected by this as many believe it's caused by a driver feature for the R300 cards only.
So far, nobody with any of those cards has brought forward any information regarding a Catalyst 3.8 heat-related issue.
All I can say is HOLY CRAP!!!!!
Now I know why my monitor was loseing signal now when I was watching tv after about an hr. I'de be watching tv, always on top, potitioned where I could surf the web, talk in mirc, and such, and was surfing checking and answering threads, and just outta the blue, no flicker, no nothing, just blammo, I get a "no signal to monitor" as if I pulled the plugin part to the back of the pc, and the monitor was on. Was weird at first. I had to reset to get out of it, because the pc was still running, I could hear the tv running, just the signal to the monitor was lost. Rebooted, and it was all fine, I went thru this about 2 times, and thought maybe it was MMC, so I switched to another version, still did its so I said ok screw this, this is to weird, and to annoying, so I went back to the 3.5's with mmc and tv, and everythings fine now. Has been for the last 2 days too.
Man I guess I was lucky, bleh, this really bites, I'de sure be mad as a hornet if I lost a nice new monitor, my whole setup is only 4mo old, so it'd really piss me off, enuff probably to go to the dark side, dare I say it.....nvidia....eeeep, I said it, AHHH, my ears .
Anyways, I feel for those that have been bit by this horrid bug.
I am convinced, so it's back to the 3.5's for me, seen as how the 3.6 and 3.7 have 32 big gl broken , otherwise I'de use the 3.7's, bleh.....3 drivers, and first they broke gl, NOW they break hardware, gee, can it get any worse, I really hope ati thinks about this, this is NOT a good mark on thier record, AT all.
0
Geeky1University of the Pacific (Stockton, CA, USA)
edited October 2003
seversphere, it's most likely just a coincidence. However, if what died was part of the agp power/signaling circuitry, then all bets are off.
I wouldn't risk running the 3.8s on any card right now, whether they're reporting problems or not. I've got enough problems with my comps (like leaving the clr_cmos jumper on the K7D in the clr position and then turning the stupid thing on... ) that I don't want to deal with it. Besides, I don't want to kill my 21" Sony CPD-G520...
Vck6v3 had this to say I am interested in something that i think nobody has mentioned anything about LCDs.
Does this problem affect LCD monitors?
Thanks
Vic
PS. seems like a nice forum
LCD monitors have no hardware relay that goes crazy when you swap resolutions, so i think you'd be fine. Atleast i havent noticed my LCD fry up from this issue..
However, (havent read page 4 yet here) - can this issue be related to OpenGL games only, or both D3D and OpenGL ? - Reason i ask is:
On Cat 3.7 the Call of Duty demos had no problems. On Cat 3.8 i get freezups and VPU Recover. This happens after a few minutes of play if i have high settings/resolution, but not with low details/resolution..
However, Max Payne 2 works like a charm for hours, running on 1024x768, AA/AF on, but then again, that game is D3D...
I noticed a screenshot posted, showing off artifacts in a game that looked like RTCW or something.. OpenGL right?
Right Ive got a club3d 9600pro and Im getting exactly the same refresh rate problems with the 3.8 cats. Games like Raven Shield cause my monitor (a sony trinitron G200) to flicker on and off as if rapidly changing refresh rate. When booting into windows I also get stuck at 60hz unless I change my 3D settings to a new AA rate (!). Its nuts I know.
These are the worst drivers Ive ever had from any product and considering I changed from a GF3 ti500 last week I am not a happy bunny.
I too am having trouble with Cat 3.8 but it seems different from what you folks described. Below is the email I sent to ATI (still waiting for their reply). Can some kind soul kindly look through my email & tell me what you think is wrong? Thanks so much!
I am encountering some problems with my Hercules 9700 Pro. Previously I was using Herc's Catalyst 3.4 & never encountered any problems.
About a week ago, I uninstalled Cat 3.4 & installed Herc's Cat 3.8. Everything seemed fine initially. A few days later I installed Jedi Academy. One day as I was visiting a website, my monitor suddenly went black & the monitor's green led light kept flashing. When my monitor turned itself on again, the display was a huge mess. I could barely see what was written but I did see a dialog box from VPU Recover.
As the display was too messed up, I couldn't see what it said & had no choice but to reboot. When Win XP Home loaded, the display was still a mess. I then rebooted into Safe Mode & uninstalled the Catalyst Control Panel followed by the Cat 3.8 drivers. Following advice from friends, I also used this utility called CabCleaner 2.0 & DriverCleaner 2.0 to ensure all traces of ATI drivers have been removed from my PC.
After that I rebooted. I tried reinstalling Herc's Cat 3.8 but the display was still screwed up. I uninstalled it (including using the 2 utilities) & decided to revert to Herc's Cat 3.4 which never caused me any trouble in the past. To my surprise, my PC seemed to reject it. The installation of Cat 3.4 was fine but when the PC was booting up there was a problem. After the black screen with Win logo appeared, my monitor would go black & the green led will flash. After a while, the PC will reboot itself.
It would later go into a screen which had this message: "Windows didn't start successfully. Recent hardware / software changes might have caused it. If the computer stopped responding / restarted unexpectedly, choose Last Known Good Config."
I decided to choose Safe Mode. When the PC booted up in Safe Mode, Windows displayed a message saying "Computer restarted after an unexpected shutdown. Win detected a possible device failure. The driver for the display device was unable to complete a drawing operation. Pls check with manufacturer for driver update. Pls tell MS about this problem. The display driver for Radeon 9700 Pro seems to be responsible for the system instability".
At the end of this message there is an option to see what data the error report contains. I clicked on it & it said "Error signature: szAppName : Drivers.Display szAppVer : 10024E440000021002 szModName : ati2dvag.dll szModVer : 6.14.10.6343 Offset : B42106EA"
After I closed that dialog box, I once again removed all traces of the Cat 3.4 drivers. This time I decided to install ATI's Cat 3.6 drivers. To my amazement, the same thing occurred. As I said, its almost as if my PC will only accept 3.8. When I try 3.4 or 3.6 (regardless of whether its from ATI or Herc), it will always auto reboot & give me the message about Windows not starting sucessfully. 3.8 is the only Catalyst which doesn't give me that, bad sadly it also gives me screwed up display.
I shut off my PC for an hour & tried again later. I removed all traces of ATI's 3.6 & decided to install Herc's 3.8 again to see how it would fare. This time round the display was not screwed up. As I was rejoicing, I noticed the mouse cursor started looking wierd. And before I knew it, the display was screwed up again. I rebooted & as it was loading, my PC hung at the Windows welcome screen. I rebooted again & this time it didn't hang. Not only that but the display was alright too.
I was overjoyed & proceeded to use my PC. Unfortunately, that very evening as I was surfing websites, the monitor went black again with flashing led light. When it came back to life, once again the display was screwed up with a barely visible dialog box about VPU Recover. A reboot didn't help much & the display was just as bad. I removed all traces of Herc 3.8 & tried to install ATI 3.8 instead. The display was also screwed up. It was late, so I shut off everything & went to sleep. The next morning I booted up in Safe Mode & removed all traces of ATI's 3.8.
I then tried installing Herc's Cat 3.4. This time round the PC didn't auto reboot during boot up & when Win loaded everything seemed fine. Overjoyed, I decided to check my email. Alas, my PC hung shortly after. When I rebooted, the PC auto rebooted & displayed that same message about
Windows not starting sucessfully.
I have since given up trying & removed all traces of Cat drivers & am just using standard VGA drivers. It should be noted though that after I removed the Cat drivers, after booting up Windows in normal mode, I got the message "The system has recovered from a serious error. A log has been created. We have created an error report. To see what data this error report contains, click here". I clicked & it said "Error signature: BCCode : c0000415 BCP1 : E1D74130 BCP2 : 00000000 BCP3 : 00000000 BCP4 : 00000000 OSVer : 5_1_2600 SP : 1_0 Product : 768_1"
Ever since the problem occurred yesterday, I have tried Herc's Catalyst 3.4 & 3.8 and also ATI's Catalyst 3.4, 3.6 & 3.8. And this is a summary of my findings. Regardless of whether its ATI or Herc's Catalyst, my PC appears to reject anything but 3.8. Cat 3.4 & 3.6 always resulted in the PC rebooting itself. There is a screen with black background & Win XP logo with a green status bar below it. That is the screen where after a while my monitor will go black & its green led light flashes.
After a while, the monitor will come back on & the PC will auto reboot & display a message saying "Windows didn't start successfully. Recent hardware / software changes might have caused it. If the computer stopped responding / restarted unexpectedly, choose Last Known Good Config." The only driver which doesn't result in this occurring is Cat 3.8 (regardless of ATI or Herc's version). However with 3.8 my display is screwed up with lots of lines & garbage all over.
My Win XP Home is updated with the latest patches & its build is 2600.xpsp2.030422-1633: Service Pack 1. A virus scan confirmed there are no viruses. The hard disk has been checked with Norton Win Doctor, Speed Disk & Disk Doctor. No faults were found. My Direct X is 9.0b. I would like to state once again that my PC was perfectly fine & never encountered any problems when I was using Herc's Cat 3.4. These disasters occurred only after I uninstalled 3.4 & installed 3.8.
I know its a long post, sorry but I'm at my wits' end!! :banghead:
I too am having trouble with Cat 3.8 but it seems different from what you folks described. Below is the email I sent to ATI (still waiting for their reply). Can some kind soul kindly look through my email & tell me what you think is wrong? Thanks so much!
I am encountering some problems with my Hercules 9700 Pro. Previously I was using Herc's Catalyst 3.4 & never encountered any problems.
768_1"
[/B]
OK I had a very similar problem when I wanted to get rid of the 3.8's. First try removing them via the add remove programs applet in the control panel. If this doesnt work you might be able to get rid of them with driver cleaner in safe mode, try looking here:
OK I had a very similar problem when I wanted to get rid of the 3.8's. First try removing them via the add remove programs applet in the control panel. If this doesnt work you might be able to get rid of them with driver cleaner in safe mode, try looking here:
I must not that this didnt work for me! Only the add remove programs applet really cleaned the drivers up.
Actually I did try that. I booted up in Safe Mode & uninstalled 3.8 from Control Panel's Add/Remove software. Then I deleted C:\ATI & rebooted. I went into Safe Mode again & use CabCleaner 2.0 followed by DriverCleaner 2.0. I even used Regedit & found 1 ATi key which I deleted.
I then rebooted normally & tried to install 3.4 (also tried 3.6). Didn't work. It rebooted as per my long LONG msg before this. I already uninstalled AND used CabCleaner AND used DriverCleaner AND manually delete 1 leftover registry key. I don't understand this!! :bawling:
Why is my PC still rebooting itself when I try to install 3.4 or 3.6? Its as if the wretched 3.8 has made my PC allergic to earlier versions, even though I'm quite sure I removed all traces of 3.8 by uninstalling, CabCleaner, DriverCleaner & Regedit!
I bought myself new hardware on the weekend and after installing them I installed the Catalyst 3.8 and started playing...
Max Payne 2 started crashing, so did Live for Speed, I wondered what it could be.
I bought a Barton 3200 and an ASUS Nforce 2 Board 400 Deluxe and 2 x 512 MB Infineon RAM.
First I thought it was the RAM and turned it down to 166 from 200 MHZ. That seemd to fix the problem, but yesterday evening it all started getting worse.
In Live for Speed I had freezes and Graphic errors, in Max Payne 2 I had hangs, crashes to desktop and comlete restarts.
Luckily my graphics card still works and my monitor does too, so when I get home today I guess the first thing I'll do is to rid myself of those 3.8 drivers and put the 3.7 back on.
A question: Sometimes my windows seemed damn slow in building up menus and stuff, could that also be a graphics card problem (It is a comletely fresh install due to the new mb).
found this thread via the INQ and I too have had something similar happen trying the new 3.8 driver, although it wasn't as drastic as what some others here experienced.
I am using a 9700P and a Samtron 96P monitor. After I installed the 3.8 I noticed that on each boot the desktop would pop up, completely load, then blacken out for a couple of seconds and finally reappear.
The device manager revealed that the Catalyst apparently installed its own *.inf file for the monitor and did so for both monitor connections of the card - I had two entries under "monitors."
Simply deleting one of the entries prove unsuccessful, as Windows would upon further boots complain that it needed a driver for the second display.
I had a problem with the 3.7 drivers handing a too low refresh rate to the monitor, which I had to manually adjust, and perhaps this time around that was my luck. Had the 3.8 handed the highest possible refresh rate the Radeon can handle to the monitor, as this is what apparently happened to some here, my monitor would probably be gone for good.
I have a Radeon 9500 non-pro 64 MB soft-mod to 9500 Pro using Omega 3.8, and Hyundai Q17 LCD analog. does this "monitor death" problem affect me as well ?
I have a Radeon 9500 non-pro 64 MB soft-mod to 9500 Pro using Omega 3.8, and Hyundai Q17 LCD analog. does this "monitor death" problem affect me as well ?
so far I have no problems with any games I have.
thx a lot
As per the previous posts, it seeems that LCD monitors would not have the problem, however, your card would be at risk for damage due to the new 'features' of the drivers. I would be hesistant to stay with the 3.8's
Vordack had this to say A question: Sometimes my windows seemed damn slow in building up menus and stuff, could that also be a graphics card problem (It is a comletely fresh install due to the new mb).
Cya
I had this problem when I had the cat 3.8's installed. When I dropped back to the 3.7's the problem went away.
Vordack had this to say A question: Sometimes my windows seemed damn slow in building up menus and stuff, could that also be a graphics card problem (It is a comletely fresh install due to the new mb).
Cya
I had this problem when I had the cat 3.8's installed. When I dropped back to the 3.7's the problem went away.
At least u could drop back. When I tried to go back to Cat 3.6, I had a headache! Just check out my ultra long post above! :mad2:
I'm just going to confirm that I am successfully running 3.8s on my Radeon 9000 with absolutely no problems. I don't think there's any problems with these drivers for non-R300 cards.
I have been using the Cat. 3.8's since the release date, and have yet to experience any problems. I have overclocked my card to 420/365 and that's infact a little longer than I could with Cat. 3.7...
I'm just wondering what is really causing this... does the card infact get warmer because it's sending out at a higher Hz to the monitor or is it something else?
I have ReForce installed so that I can play with proper refreshrates in games, and I have fixed that on every "monitor" that comes up in ReForce. Can this have something to do with the fact that it is working on my comp? Since all the monitor inf. files (I assume that is what ReForce uses) have fixed refreshrates?
@wheek
Have you tried reverting to the windows standard driver(vgaSave or w/e), and then re-installing the cats? Also, have you tried a system restore to before when you installed the drivers? Your situation sounds like you may need a format and re-install tho
@SBS
SimGuy mentioned that no one is really sure exactly what is causing the overheat, but gave some possible sources
SimGuy had this to say 1) While we're not quite sure what part of the Catalyst 3.8 drivers are causing this, some part of the driver (whether it's the new VPU Recovery feature, HyperZ Enhancements or the ATI Overclocking software) is causing the core on BBA and OEM Radeon cards that are identified as "RADEON 9800 XT", "RADEON 9800 PRO" and "RADEON 9800" in Windows to have their GPU's overheat by as much as 15*C over normal during 3D graphics sessions. This has caused a number of fans on the Radeon 9800 XT series to fail, allowing the heat to completely destroy the card.
...
I did some testing with my Radeon 9800 NP BIOS-flashed to a 9800 Pro. The results are not encouraging.
Running looping 3DMark2003 for 30 minutes and utilizing a temperature probe on my GPU (regular cooling), the following temperatures were recorded:
Catalyst 3.8: 135 Fahrenheit Catalyst 3.7: 117 Fahrenheit
...
2) Updated Information Regarding Monitor Death Problem Available! - Radeon 9700's Affected!
The Catalyst 3.8's seem to have a bug in some systems that allows the driver to process the SECONDARY adapter settings when a game is started and tries to switch to the resolution and refresh rate specified in the program.
Normally, the card is limited by the INF file settings for the PRIMARY adapter, so that no resolution or refresh rate is attempted that is beyond the capability of the monitor hardware. But in the 3.8's, it seems to be processing the SECONDARY adapter settings first. In a system without a monitor plugged into the second adapter, there is no INF file limiting refresh rates and resolutions, so, the system is trying to force refresh rates and resolutions beyond what the monitor on the PRIMARY adapter is capable of.
So instead of having the monitor "flicker" once when it switches to the desired resolution/refresh, monitors are "flickering" between 4 and 8 times, with resolutions and refresh rates that are beyond the capability of the actual monitor.
As a result, some monitors have been damaged, while others have blinked out and recovered. Some users monitors are under warranty and can be RMA'd, but for those who don't have a monitor under warranty, their monitor is damaged and they must buy a new one.
...
I have many of these cards and have been using the 3.8 for a few weeks now Doug,, I have seen none of the overheating problems you have discussed here in any form. I sent out an email blast to over a thousand people who own the card asking this question and have recieved no input validating this. Maybe a modded or heavily overclocked card shows these symptoms but for the average user I think this is a mote point.
I will make this an available forum on my site as well to see what if any other problems are being discovered.
I haven't heard of this problem yet... usually the refresh rate problem would plague systems when they are changing resolutions (such as when exiting an OGL or D3D game), not just "out of the blue." Either way, I'm glad you installed the older drivers, as if it did eliminate this problem (and it sure sounds like it did), then I'd say it has to be caused by the Catalyst 3.8 series.
BTW, for everyone reading, if you have had any type of problem with ATI's Catalyst software (whether it's 3.8 or any of the other packages), please send them a bug-report, outlining exactly what happened.
easyrider had this to say All I can say is HOLY CRAP!!!!!
Now I know why my monitor was loseing signal now when I was watching tv after about an hr. I'de be watching tv, always on top, potitioned where I could surf the web, talk in mirc, and such, and was surfing checking and answering threads, and just outta the blue, no flicker, no nothing, just blammo, I get a "no signal to monitor" as if I pulled the plugin part to the back of the pc, and the monitor was on. Was weird at first. I had to reset to get out of it, because the pc was still running, I could hear the tv running, just the signal to the monitor was lost. Rebooted, and it was all fine, I went thru this about 2 times, and thought maybe it was MMC, so I switched to another version, still did its so I said ok screw this, this is to weird, and to annoying, so I went back to the 3.5's with mmc and tv, and everythings fine now. Has been for the last 2 days too.
Man I guess I was lucky, bleh, this really bites, I'de sure be mad as a hornet if I lost a nice new monitor, my whole setup is only 4mo old, so it'd really piss me off, enuff probably to go to the dark side, dare I say it.....nvidia....eeeep, I said it, AHHH, my ears .
Anyways, I feel for those that have been bit by this horrid bug.
I am convinced, so it's back to the 3.5's for me, seen as how the 3.6 and 3.7 have 32 big gl broken , otherwise I'de use the 3.7's, bleh.....3 drivers, and first they broke gl, NOW they break hardware, gee, can it get any worse, I really hope ati thinks about this, this is NOT a good mark on thier record, AT all.
The problem seems to be related to both OpenGL & Direct3D applications. Of the reports that I have been receiving, the refresh rate problem usually hits when you are exiting a 3D application and your monitor attempts to change back to the desktop resolution.
When my Dell UltraScan P1110 21" Trinitron died, it was caused by the refresh rate bug when exiting a Direct3D application (UT2003).
As for the screenshot, that particular shot showed what happened due to the overheating problem. Notice the broken textures, green scanlines and skewed image. Yes, it was RTCW
cairnz had this to say
Vck6v3 had this to say I am interested in something that i think nobody has mentioned anything about LCDs.
Does this problem affect LCD monitors?
Thanks
Vic
PS. seems like a nice forum
LCD monitors have no hardware relay that goes crazy when you swap resolutions, so i think you'd be fine. Atleast i havent noticed my LCD fry up from this issue..
However, (havent read page 4 yet here) - can this issue be related to OpenGL games only, or both D3D and OpenGL ? - Reason i ask is:
On Cat 3.7 the Call of Duty demos had no problems. On Cat 3.8 i get freezups and VPU Recover. This happens after a few minutes of play if i have high settings/resolution, but not with low details/resolution..
However, Max Payne 2 works like a charm for hours, running on 1024x768, AA/AF on, but then again, that game is D3D...
I noticed a screenshot posted, showing off artifacts in a game that looked like RTCW or something.. OpenGL right?
Welcome to Short-Media startledpancake! (great name!)
Don't convert to the dark side! LOL J/K
Definately the refresh rate problem. Roll back to Catalyst 3.7 (or, if you don't like the OpenGL 32-bit problem), roll back to the Catalyst 3.5's to completely get rid of this problem.
BTW, did you have your 9600 Pro overclocked at all?
startledpancake had this to say First of all Ill start by saying hello. Hello.
Right Ive got a club3d 9600pro and Im getting exactly the same refresh rate problems with the 3.8 cats. Games like Raven Shield cause my monitor (a sony trinitron G200) to flicker on and off as if rapidly changing refresh rate. When booting into windows I also get stuck at 60hz unless I change my 3D settings to a new AA rate (!). Its nuts I know.
These are the worst drivers Ive ever had from any product and considering I changed from a GF3 ti500 last week I am not a happy bunny.
SimGuy had this to say Welcome to Short-Media startledpancake! (great name!)
Don't convert to the dark side! LOL J/K
Definately the refresh rate problem. Roll back to Catalyst 3.7 (or, if you don't like the OpenGL 32-bit problem), roll back to the Catalyst 3.5's to completely get rid of this problem.
BTW, did you have your 9600 Pro overclocked at all?
Cheers for the welcome, this does seem a friendly place!
Which side a card falls on appears to be very much based on your point of view, I guess those guys staring at blank screens might consider themselves on the "Dark Side" . Mine is kind of a the dark/light/dark/light/dark/light crash variety but it cant break a quality sony monitor no matter how hard it tries.
The roll back to 3.7 hasnt entirely cleared this up unfortnatly but it is better. OpenGL isnt an issue for me, I hear good things about the 3.4's so I might try those.
My 9600 is overclocked to 450/337 but going back to stock settings doesnt make any difference. For a new midrange card this one struggles with latests games/high resolutions more so than my ti500 did 18 months ago.
0
Geeky1University of the Pacific (Stockton, CA, USA)
edited October 2003
Yeah, unfortunately the 9600 isn't what I would call an outstanding card. It's only real redemptive quality is that the GeForceFX 5600 Ultra is a lot worse... I assume you saw that article about how the Radeon 9600 Pro is faster in HL2 than the 5900 Ultra, right?
How did you go about removing the Catalyst 3.8's? In my experience, I've found that simply uninstalling them and installing older (or newer) Catalyst drivers doesn't completely remove the original installation.
Rage3D has a great Catalyst uninstallation/installation guide that has worked great for me and many others. Check it out here.
startledpancake had this to say
SimGuy had this to say Welcome to Short-Media startledpancake! (great name!)
Don't convert to the dark side! LOL J/K
Definately the refresh rate problem. Roll back to Catalyst 3.7 (or, if you don't like the OpenGL 32-bit problem), roll back to the Catalyst 3.5's to completely get rid of this problem.
BTW, did you have your 9600 Pro overclocked at all?
Cheers for the welcome, this does seem a friendly place!
Which side a card falls on appears to be very much based on your point of view, I guess those guys staring at blank screens might consider themselves on the "Dark Side" . Mine is kind of a the dark/light/dark/light/dark/light crash variety but it cant break a quality sony monitor no matter how hard it tries.
The roll back to 3.7 hasnt entirely cleared this up unfortnatly but it is better. OpenGL isnt an issue for me, I hear good things about the 3.4's so I might try those.
My 9600 is overclocked to 450/337 but going back to stock settings doesnt make any difference. For a new midrange card this one struggles with latests games/high resolutions more so than my ti500 did 18 months ago.
Comments
That number of dead monitors have come from the following sources:
Rage3D Forums, myself, friends of mine, people who have PM'ed me on Short-Media and any and all e-mails I have received regarding this issue.
The number continues to grow.
So far, nobody with any of those cards has brought forward any information regarding a Catalyst 3.8 heat-related issue.
IMHO, I wouldn't chance it though.
Now I know why my monitor was loseing signal now when I was watching tv after about an hr. I'de be watching tv, always on top, potitioned where I could surf the web, talk in mirc, and such, and was surfing checking and answering threads, and just outta the blue, no flicker, no nothing, just blammo, I get a "no signal to monitor" as if I pulled the plugin part to the back of the pc, and the monitor was on. Was weird at first. I had to reset to get out of it, because the pc was still running, I could hear the tv running, just the signal to the monitor was lost. Rebooted, and it was all fine, I went thru this about 2 times, and thought maybe it was MMC, so I switched to another version, still did its so I said ok screw this, this is to weird, and to annoying, so I went back to the 3.5's with mmc and tv, and everythings fine now. Has been for the last 2 days too.
Man I guess I was lucky, bleh, this really bites, I'de sure be mad as a hornet if I lost a nice new monitor, my whole setup is only 4mo old, so it'd really piss me off, enuff probably to go to the dark side, dare I say it.....nvidia....eeeep, I said it, AHHH, my ears .
Anyways, I feel for those that have been bit by this horrid bug.
I am convinced, so it's back to the 3.5's for me, seen as how the 3.6 and 3.7 have 32 big gl broken , otherwise I'de use the 3.7's, bleh.....3 drivers, and first they broke gl, NOW they break hardware, gee, can it get any worse, I really hope ati thinks about this, this is NOT a good mark on thier record, AT all.
I wouldn't risk running the 3.8s on any card right now, whether they're reporting problems or not. I've got enough problems with my comps (like leaving the clr_cmos jumper on the K7D in the clr position and then turning the stupid thing on...
LCD monitors have no hardware relay that goes crazy when you swap resolutions, so i think you'd be fine. Atleast i havent noticed my LCD fry up from this issue..
However, (havent read page 4 yet here) - can this issue be related to OpenGL games only, or both D3D and OpenGL ? - Reason i ask is:
On Cat 3.7 the Call of Duty demos had no problems. On Cat 3.8 i get freezups and VPU Recover. This happens after a few minutes of play if i have high settings/resolution, but not with low details/resolution..
However, Max Payne 2 works like a charm for hours, running on 1024x768, AA/AF on, but then again, that game is D3D...
I noticed a screenshot posted, showing off artifacts in a game that looked like RTCW or something.. OpenGL right?
any thoughts?
Right Ive got a club3d 9600pro and Im getting exactly the same refresh rate problems with the 3.8 cats. Games like Raven Shield cause my monitor (a sony trinitron G200) to flicker on and off as if rapidly changing refresh rate. When booting into windows I also get stuck at 60hz unless I change my 3D settings to a new AA rate (!). Its nuts I know.
These are the worst drivers Ive ever had from any product and considering I changed from a GF3 ti500 last week I am not a happy bunny.
I too am having trouble with Cat 3.8 but it seems different from what you folks described. Below is the email I sent to ATI (still waiting for their reply). Can some kind soul kindly look through my email & tell me what you think is wrong? Thanks so much!
I am encountering some problems with my Hercules 9700 Pro. Previously I was using Herc's Catalyst 3.4 & never encountered any problems.
About a week ago, I uninstalled Cat 3.4 & installed Herc's Cat 3.8. Everything seemed fine initially. A few days later I installed Jedi Academy. One day as I was visiting a website, my monitor suddenly went black & the monitor's green led light kept flashing. When my monitor turned itself on again, the display was a huge mess. I could barely see what was written but I did see a dialog box from VPU Recover.
As the display was too messed up, I couldn't see what it said & had no choice but to reboot. When Win XP Home loaded, the display was still a mess. I then rebooted into Safe Mode & uninstalled the Catalyst Control Panel followed by the Cat 3.8 drivers. Following advice from friends, I also used this utility called CabCleaner 2.0 & DriverCleaner 2.0 to ensure all traces of ATI drivers have been removed from my PC.
After that I rebooted. I tried reinstalling Herc's Cat 3.8 but the display was still screwed up. I uninstalled it (including using the 2 utilities) & decided to revert to Herc's Cat 3.4 which never caused me any trouble in the past. To my surprise, my PC seemed to reject it. The installation of Cat 3.4 was fine but when the PC was booting up there was a problem. After the black screen with Win logo appeared, my monitor would go black & the green led will flash. After a while, the PC will reboot itself.
It would later go into a screen which had this message: "Windows didn't start successfully. Recent hardware / software changes might have caused it. If the computer stopped responding / restarted unexpectedly, choose Last Known Good Config."
I decided to choose Safe Mode. When the PC booted up in Safe Mode, Windows displayed a message saying "Computer restarted after an unexpected shutdown. Win detected a possible device failure. The driver for the display device was unable to complete a drawing operation. Pls check with manufacturer for driver update. Pls tell MS about this problem. The display driver for Radeon 9700 Pro seems to be responsible for the system instability".
At the end of this message there is an option to see what data the error report contains. I clicked on it & it said "Error signature: szAppName : Drivers.Display szAppVer : 10024E440000021002 szModName : ati2dvag.dll szModVer : 6.14.10.6343 Offset : B42106EA"
After I closed that dialog box, I once again removed all traces of the Cat 3.4 drivers. This time I decided to install ATI's Cat 3.6 drivers. To my amazement, the same thing occurred. As I said, its almost as if my PC will only accept 3.8. When I try 3.4 or 3.6 (regardless of whether its from ATI or Herc), it will always auto reboot & give me the message about Windows not starting sucessfully. 3.8 is the only Catalyst which doesn't give me that, bad sadly it also gives me screwed up display.
I shut off my PC for an hour & tried again later. I removed all traces of ATI's 3.6 & decided to install Herc's 3.8 again to see how it would fare. This time round the display was not screwed up. As I was rejoicing, I noticed the mouse cursor started looking wierd. And before I knew it, the display was screwed up again. I rebooted & as it was loading, my PC hung at the Windows welcome screen. I rebooted again & this time it didn't hang. Not only that but the display was alright too.
I was overjoyed & proceeded to use my PC. Unfortunately, that very evening as I was surfing websites, the monitor went black again with flashing led light. When it came back to life, once again the display was screwed up with a barely visible dialog box about VPU Recover. A reboot didn't help much & the display was just as bad. I removed all traces of Herc 3.8 & tried to install ATI 3.8 instead. The display was also screwed up. It was late, so I shut off everything & went to sleep. The next morning I booted up in Safe Mode & removed all traces of ATI's 3.8.
I then tried installing Herc's Cat 3.4. This time round the PC didn't auto reboot during boot up & when Win loaded everything seemed fine. Overjoyed, I decided to check my email. Alas, my PC hung shortly after. When I rebooted, the PC auto rebooted & displayed that same message about
Windows not starting sucessfully.
I have since given up trying & removed all traces of Cat drivers & am just using standard VGA drivers. It should be noted though that after I removed the Cat drivers, after booting up Windows in normal mode, I got the message "The system has recovered from a serious error. A log has been created. We have created an error report. To see what data this error report contains, click here". I clicked & it said "Error signature: BCCode : c0000415 BCP1 : E1D74130 BCP2 : 00000000 BCP3 : 00000000 BCP4 : 00000000 OSVer : 5_1_2600 SP : 1_0 Product : 768_1"
Ever since the problem occurred yesterday, I have tried Herc's Catalyst 3.4 & 3.8 and also ATI's Catalyst 3.4, 3.6 & 3.8. And this is a summary of my findings. Regardless of whether its ATI or Herc's Catalyst, my PC appears to reject anything but 3.8. Cat 3.4 & 3.6 always resulted in the PC rebooting itself. There is a screen with black background & Win XP logo with a green status bar below it. That is the screen where after a while my monitor will go black & its green led light flashes.
After a while, the monitor will come back on & the PC will auto reboot & display a message saying "Windows didn't start successfully. Recent hardware / software changes might have caused it. If the computer stopped responding / restarted unexpectedly, choose Last Known Good Config." The only driver which doesn't result in this occurring is Cat 3.8 (regardless of ATI or Herc's version). However with 3.8 my display is screwed up with lots of lines & garbage all over.
My Win XP Home is updated with the latest patches & its build is 2600.xpsp2.030422-1633: Service Pack 1. A virus scan confirmed there are no viruses. The hard disk has been checked with Norton Win Doctor, Speed Disk & Disk Doctor. No faults were found. My Direct X is 9.0b. I would like to state once again that my PC was perfectly fine & never encountered any problems when I was using Herc's Cat 3.4. These disasters occurred only after I uninstalled 3.4 & installed 3.8.
I know its a long post, sorry but I'm at my wits' end!! :banghead:
OK I had a very similar problem when I wanted to get rid of the 3.8's. First try removing them via the add remove programs applet in the control panel. If this doesnt work you might be able to get rid of them with driver cleaner in safe mode, try looking here:
http://www.driverheaven.net/cleaner/
I must not that this didnt work for me! Only the add remove programs applet really cleaned the drivers up.
I bought myself new hardware on the weekend and after installing them I installed the Catalyst 3.8 and started playing...
Max Payne 2 started crashing, so did Live for Speed, I wondered what it could be.
I bought a Barton 3200 and an ASUS Nforce 2 Board 400 Deluxe and 2 x 512 MB Infineon RAM.
First I thought it was the RAM and turned it down to 166 from 200 MHZ. That seemd to fix the problem, but yesterday evening it all started getting worse.
In Live for Speed I had freezes and Graphic errors, in Max Payne 2 I had hangs, crashes to desktop and comlete restarts.
Luckily my graphics card still works and my monitor does too, so when I get home today I guess the first thing I'll do is to rid myself of those 3.8 drivers and put the 3.7 back on.
A question: Sometimes my windows seemed damn slow in building up menus and stuff, could that also be a graphics card problem (It is a comletely fresh install due to the new mb).
Cya
found this thread via the INQ and I too have had something similar happen trying the new 3.8 driver, although it wasn't as drastic as what some others here experienced.
I am using a 9700P and a Samtron 96P monitor. After I installed the 3.8 I noticed that on each boot the desktop would pop up, completely load, then blacken out for a couple of seconds and finally reappear.
The device manager revealed that the Catalyst apparently installed its own *.inf file for the monitor and did so for both monitor connections of the card - I had two entries under "monitors."
Simply deleting one of the entries prove unsuccessful, as Windows would upon further boots complain that it needed a driver for the second display.
I had a problem with the 3.7 drivers handing a too low refresh rate to the monitor, which I had to manually adjust, and perhaps this time around that was my luck. Had the 3.8 handed the highest possible refresh rate the Radeon can handle to the monitor, as this is what apparently happened to some here, my monitor would probably be gone for good.
Infidel
I have a Radeon 9500 non-pro 64 MB soft-mod to 9500 Pro using Omega 3.8, and Hyundai Q17 LCD analog. does this "monitor death" problem affect me as well ?
so far I have no problems with any games I have.
thx a lot
Thanks for your comments & experiences (and questions!)
<b>SimGuy</b> is our resident GPU guru.. so Il leave him to answer your questions and thoughts
Stick around, I can see this is gonna be one long thread of information & varied scenarios
as suspected hmm... better stick with Omega 3.7 ... for now
I had this problem when I had the cat 3.8's installed. When I dropped back to the 3.7's the problem went away.
I'm just wondering what is really causing this... does the card infact get warmer because it's sending out at a higher Hz to the monitor or is it something else?
I have ReForce installed so that I can play with proper refreshrates in games, and I have fixed that on every "monitor" that comes up in ReForce. Can this have something to do with the fact that it is working on my comp? Since all the monitor inf. files (I assume that is what ReForce uses) have fixed refreshrates?
Hope someone can reply to this...
Have you tried reverting to the windows standard driver(vgaSave or w/e), and then re-installing the cats? Also, have you tried a system restore to before when you installed the drivers? Your situation sounds like you may need a format and re-install tho
@SBS
SimGuy mentioned that no one is really sure exactly what is causing the overheat, but gave some possible sources
I will make this an available forum on my site as well to see what if any other problems are being discovered.
By the way Doug thumbs up on the site.
I haven't heard of this problem yet... usually the refresh rate problem would plague systems when they are changing resolutions (such as when exiting an OGL or D3D game), not just "out of the blue." Either way, I'm glad you installed the older drivers, as if it did eliminate this problem (and it sure sounds like it did), then I'd say it has to be caused by the Catalyst 3.8 series.
BTW, for everyone reading, if you have had any type of problem with ATI's Catalyst software (whether it's 3.8 or any of the other packages), please send them a bug-report, outlining exactly what happened.
http://apps.ati.com/driverfeedback/
The problem seems to be related to both OpenGL & Direct3D applications. Of the reports that I have been receiving, the refresh rate problem usually hits when you are exiting a 3D application and your monitor attempts to change back to the desktop resolution.
When my Dell UltraScan P1110 21" Trinitron died, it was caused by the refresh rate bug when exiting a Direct3D application (UT2003).
As for the screenshot, that particular shot showed what happened due to the overheating problem. Notice the broken textures, green scanlines and skewed image. Yes, it was RTCW
The illustrious Doc Overclock steps into da house!
I'm pestering ATI to see if they can give out an inkling of information on this.
Don't convert to the dark side! LOL
Definately the refresh rate problem. Roll back to Catalyst 3.7 (or, if you don't like the OpenGL 32-bit problem), roll back to the Catalyst 3.5's to completely get rid of this problem.
BTW, did you have your 9600 Pro overclocked at all?
Cheers for the welcome, this does seem a friendly place!
Which side a card falls on appears to be very much based on your point of view, I guess those guys staring at blank screens might consider themselves on the "Dark Side"
The roll back to 3.7 hasnt entirely cleared this up unfortnatly but it is better. OpenGL isnt an issue for me, I hear good things about the 3.4's so I might try those.
My 9600 is overclocked to 450/337 but going back to stock settings doesnt make any difference. For a new midrange card this one struggles with latests games/high resolutions more so than my ti500 did 18 months ago.
How did you go about removing the Catalyst 3.8's? In my experience, I've found that simply uninstalling them and installing older (or newer) Catalyst drivers doesn't completely remove the original installation.
Rage3D has a great Catalyst uninstallation/installation guide that has worked great for me and many others. Check it out here.
I will closely follow this post to see what the end results bring to the table.;)